Need help with 2 nic standalone core network setup

[pixelator]

Ok..
If your wireless nodes are connecting directly to your fios router, I assume they also can connect to the internet?

Technically, everything behind your VZ router is the LAN. The VZ router seperates the WAN and LAN. This is a bit different from cable and DSL services which use a modem and allow you to seperate that from your LAN. The LMCE dual nic setup assumes there is an internal (lan) interface and external (wan) interface that it will route between.
Because your core is techically on the LAN, you cannot route between the external (eth0) and internal (eth1) interfaces because they are on the same subnet/netmask.

Concerning your set up, you will either need to place the core in front of the VZ router (wan side) to use the dual nic setup [this will require you to contact VZ and get their WAN connection info - I believe FIOS still uses PPPOE for their inet services], or connect the eth1 interface directly to your LAN switch and disable eth0 (external interface).

The other thing that could be an issue with VZ is that they also route their On-Demand and Guide Data for TV services through their router [at least on the vz fios installs I have seen] and I don't know hoe that will effect the placement of the core in front of the VZ router. Logically, if the network is set up correctly, this should not be an issue.

One of the quirks with LMCE managing DHCP and not being the gateway is that it will also tell network nodes to use it [core] as the DNS server, and the Default gateway so you will need to make some changes to the network files in lmce and possibly manually apply the default GW and DNS info in the network nodes.

It is easier to suggest a solution using a diagram than try to explain it here.
I'll see about designing one and post it here.

Where have i seen you before? you on LQ? or was it Pluto?

I spent time on pluto for a while before switching to LMCE.

[DeadPenguin]

Pixelator thanks. I appreciate the help.

When I get the PPOE info from VZ. (the techs are actually pretty decent) What do I do with the info? 

VZ has a COAX running to my/their router.
VZ phone goes from ONT and connects to my rj11 home run.

Here is the diagram I did to make setup a little easier on myself. But when I setup this way I lose internet. Because I am not connecting to VZ.



I am excited to get this working.

Regards,
Blair

[teedge77]

are you using the FIOS router as the gateway still? what is dhcp handing out for dns, gateway and ip addresses and subnet mask? also what are the addresses for linuxmces (which ones 192.168.1.1?) nics and the fios router ip address?

in your picture you have linuxmce as the gateway to the internet. obviously it still has to go through the fios router so your diagram is a little confusing. theres no way to get to the internet without going through the fios router. if you have dhcp setting linuxmce as the gateway, you still need to have linuxmce using the fios router as its gateway. then itll go

MD/PC > LinuxMCE > FIOS > Internet


what is it that keeps you from plugging the external linuxmce nic directly to the FIOS router?

[pixelator]

Looking at your diagram, I don't see how that is working.
The VZ Fios router needs to be your gateway routing between the LAN and WAN (unless you can get the core to manage PPPOE to Verizon)

The VZ FIOS router of choice is the actiontec MI-424-WR which has one WAN port and 4 LAN ports (build in switch).
So... The easiest choice for you (in my opinion) would be to use the the Core as your PPPOE gateway, and place the VZ router on your LAN as a wireless AP (assuming verizon will allow the use of their equipment this way). Deploying this method, you would need to disable the default routing nature of the VZ Router and use it a simple switching device with wireless networking enabled. Check the documentation of the router for that info.

Using Dual NICS


Another option if you are unable to use the VZ router this way is to use only one NIC on the core and place it on you LAN. You can still allow the Core to manage you DHCP this way as well.

Using Single NIC

[teedge77]

oh yeah...i forgot you were using the fios router for your wireless too. so having it in front of the linuxmce would keep you from using them on the regular internal network that everything else was on.

[pixelator]

oh yeah...i forgot you were using the fios router for your wireless too. so having it in front of the linuxmce would keep you from using them on the regular internal network that everything else was on.

Not true. If the VZ Router was being used as the WAN gateway then anything on the LAN side can communicate. Remember the VZ router is also capable of LAN switching (built in 4 port wired switch and wireless). You can put everything behind the VZ router and make it work..BUT... if you do it this way, then you will only be able to make use of a single NIC on the core because the core will not be doing the WAN/LAN routing.

[teedge77]

i meant as far as linuxmce handing out dhcp for them. youd have to use dhcp with the fios router and have it route through the linuxmce box. hed need a different subnet for the wireless stuff then. that would make things more difficult for him. also, unless he turned off the firewall completely, he would have a lot of trouble connecting anything to anything through the linuxmce firewall to the rest of the internal network. unless he used a single nic install and everything was connected behind the fios. the way he had the diagram he wanted an internal and external. so if he used the external to connect to the fios router and the internal gave out the dhcp and ran the rest of the network that way, hed have more work to get it to route between the external and internal networks. is that right or am i missing something?

[pixelator]

i meant as far as linuxmce handing out dhcp for them. youd have to use dhcp with the fios router and have it route through the linuxmce box.

No. everything is on the same LAN, same network, same subnet. he can disable DHCP at the FIOS router and allow the Core to do it (single nic core behind the fios router)

hed need a different subnet for the wireless stuff then. that would make things more difficult for him.

No different subnet needed. I think your over-complicating this.

also, unless he turned off the firewall completely, he would have a lot of trouble connecting anything to anything through the linuxmce firewall to the rest of the internal network.

If the Core is set up behind the VZ router, then nothing will be routed through the core and the Core fire wall is taken out of the picture.

If he is going to set it up with the Dual NIC option then the Core will replace the VZ router as the WAN gateway. The VZ router would then be recommissioned as nothing more than a wireless AP/LAN switch on his LAN.

unless he used a single nic install and everything was connected behind the fios. the way he had the diagram he wanted an internal and external.

I'm not sure he "wanted" it that way or is simply not aware of how to properly set it up.
DeadPenguin said: "I am not very good with anything network related ergo the "retarded" comment."

Either way it won't happen within the context of LMCE unless he uses the Core to replace the VZ router as the WAN gateway.
There is no benefit to having dual nics in the core if it resides entirely on the LAN side.
The use of dual nics assumes that the core is also being used as the WAN gateway.

so if he used the external to connect to the fios router and the internal gave out the dhcp and ran the rest of the network that way, hed have more work to get it to route between the external and internal networks. is that right or am i missing something?

Again the Dual NIC assumes there is a WAN and LAN interface which LMCE will route between. But because as it stands now, the VZ router is managing the routing between the wan and lan, there is no need for the dual nic on the core. You cannot have a WAN and LAN interface on the same network. The external interface cannot have an internal IP and cannot be on the same subnet/netmask.

[teedge77]

No. everything is on the same LAN, same network, same subnet. he can disable DHCP at the FIOS router and allow the Core to do it (single nic core behind the fios router)

i was assuming he still wanted a dual nic setup. with a dual nic setup, with the fios doing the wan and the external linuxmce nic connected to the fios, he would use have to use a different subnet on both the wireless stuff and the stuff on the linuxmce internal network right? if it was on the same subnet it would get as far as linuxmce and linuxmce would say it must be on here but i dont see it so i wont forward it anywhere else. is that wrong?

If the Core is set up behind the VZ router, then nothing will be routed through the core and the Core fire wall is taken out of the picture.

If he is going to set it up with the Dual NIC option then the Core will replace the VZ router as the WAN gateway. The VZ router would then be recommissioned as nothing more than a wireless AP/LAN switch on his LAN.

i didnt realize that the fios used pppoe. i was thinking that hed have to use the fios to connect ....he said there was a cable...thought he meant something other than cat5 type. i do see what youre saying about the fios being just a wap. sorry...didnt know you didnt have to use the fios router for the wan.


so i was misunderstanding how he should set it up cause i was thinking that the fios router was necessary but apparently not. the fios router doesnt work as a type of modem also? does he have a fios router and some sortof modem also? if he uses linuxmce as the wan gateway what does the wan side connect to?

[pixelator]

i was assuming he still wanted a dual nic setup. with a dual nic setup, with the fios doing the wan and the external linuxmce nic connected to the fios, he would use have to use a different subnet on both the wireless stuff and the stuff on the linuxmce internal network right? if it was on the same subnet it would get as far as linuxmce and linuxmce would say it must be on here but i dont see it so i wont forward it anywhere else. is that wrong?

No, not entirely wrong. But my argument is that doing so will un-necessarily complicate the network and setting it up that way is beyond the intention of LMCE.

i didnt realize that the fios used pppoe. i was thinking that hed have to use the fios to connect ....he said there was a cable...thought he meant something other than cat5 type. i do see what youre saying about the fios being just a wap. sorry...didnt know you didnt have to use the fios router for the wan.

I am 99.9% sure it does use PPPOE. The cable (non-ethernet/cat5) connected to the fios router is for other fios bundled services. TV/Phone - but these are seperate networks and AFAIK do not crossover to the ethernet network.

so i was misunderstanding how he should set it up cause i was thinking that the fios router was necessary but apparently not. the fios router doesnt work as a type of modem also? does he have a fios router and some sortof modem also? if he uses linuxmce as the wan gateway what does the wan side connect to?

If he is able to assign PPPOE to the Core, then he should be able to put that in place of the VZ router for WAN/LAN routing. As far as a "modem" the answer is no... The actiontec is an enterprise class router built to spec for VZ, there is no modem involved with FIOS. FIOS does not require the signal conversion that a modem provides.

[teedge77]

oh i see. thats interesting. thanks.

[pixelator]

Pixelator thanks. I appreciate the help.

When I get the PPOE info from VZ. (the techs are actually pretty decent) What do I do with the info? 

to get PPPOE set up:

run pppoeconfig from a terminal and follow the on-screen instructions.
It will ask for your account name and password provided by VZ.

Then there is the small tricky part of manually editing the MySql table containing the interface connection info.
First you need to get into mysql using a terminal and use this command

Code Select Expand

mysql use pluto_main

then display the contents of the Device_DeviceData table to get your current network settings stored in LMCE by applying the following command at the mysql prompt:

Code Select Expand

select * from Device_DeviceData where FK_Device=1 and FK_DeviceData=32;

My results looked like this

Code Select Expand


+-----------+---------------+-------------------------------------------+--------+-----------+----------+------------+----------------+--------------+
| FK_Device | FK_DeviceData | IK_DeviceData                             | psc_id | psc_batch | psc_user | psc_frozen | psc_mod        | psc_restrict |
+-----------+---------------+-------------------------------------------+--------+-----------+----------+------------+----------------+--------------+
|         1 |            32 | eth0,dhcp|eth1,192.168.15.2,255.255.255.0 |   NULL |      NULL |     NULL |          0 | 20070405221738 |         NULL |
+-----------+---------------+-------------------------------------------+--------+-----------+----------+------------+----------------+--------------+

the important piece here is the IK_DeviceData field value:   eth0,dhcp|eth1,192.168.15.2,255.255.255.0

this field contains the network interface info that LMCE uses. Each interface is seperated by a "|" character.
for my two interfaces the field contains "eth0,DHCP" and "eth1,192.168.15.2,255.255.255.0 "
The trick is to make sure you change the interface info for you external interface to "ppp0"
in my case, the external interface was eth0 so I needed to change the field value from "eth0,dhcp|eth1,192.168.15.2,255.255.255.0", to "ppp0,dhcp|eth1,192.168.15.2,255.255.255.0"

note the difference between eth0 and ppp0.
To make this change in the mysql table, you would execute the sql command

Code Select Expand

update Device_DeviceData set IK_DeviceData="ppp0,dhcp|eth1,192.168.15.2,255.255.255.0" where FK_Device=1 and FK_DeviceData=32;

then if you execute the sql command

Code Select Expand

mysql> select * from Device_DeviceData where FK_Device=1 and FK_DeviceData=32;
+-----------+---------------+-------------------------------------------+--------+-----------+----------+------------+----------------+--------------+
| FK_Device | FK_DeviceData | IK_DeviceData                             | psc_id | psc_batch | psc_user | psc_frozen | psc_mod        | psc_restrict |
+-----------+---------------+-------------------------------------------+--------+-----------+----------+------------+----------------+--------------+
|         1 |            32 | ppp0,dhcp|eth1,192.168.15.2,255.255.255.0 |   NULL |      NULL |     NULL |          0 | 20070520193528 |         NULL |
+-----------+---------------+-------------------------------------------+--------+-----------+----------+------------+----------------+--------------+

you will notice that eth0 has been updated to ppp0 in the IK_DeviceData field

That's it.

[Zaerc]

To make this change in the mysql table, you would execute the sql command

Code Select Expand

update Device_DeviceData set IK_DeviceData="ppp0,dhcp|eth1,192.168.15.2,255.255.255.0" where FK_Device=1 and FK_DeviceData=32;

I think it would probably be easier to change that value in the web-admin, simply lookup the core in the devices tree and under "Device data" you should find a field called "Network Interfaces", change eth0 to ppp0 there and Bob's your uncle.

[pixelator]

I think it would probably be easier to change that value in the web-admin, simply lookup the core in the devices tree and under "Device data" you should find a field called "Network Interfaces", change eth0 to ppp0 there and Bob's your uncle.

Good call Zaerc. That's good to know.
I wasn't even aware that it could be done that way. To be honest, you'd need a PhD to understand all the available details and settings you can find in the admin pages. 

Either way, ""Six Of One, A Half Dozen Of The Other"... but it is probably safer to do it from the web-admin.

[DeadPenguin]

FANTASTIC!!!!     Pixelator thanks.

I actually figured out the "sudo ppoeconfig" part on my own. I just couldn't figure out why I was still not getting internet on connected computers. (I was getting the an ip from VZ on PPP0 and I could "ping google.com" from the router but nowhere else.

Thanks for the how-to on how to change dchp to PPOe. Thanks Zaerc for the other option.

One question:  Do I have to run "pon dsl-provider" everytime I reboot or shutdown the server?

You guys have been a great help. I hope to get a chance tonight to try again.

Anyone know if that COAX connection is important to VZ?  I was on with a tech last night for an hour trying to fix my connection and he didn't give me a definitive answer.

For PPOE VZ said the username was either verizonfios or fios and the password was whatever I picked it to be.

Best Regards,
Blair