How big of a donation?

[ZaPHoN]

Just wondering what kind of milestones could be set for LinuxMCE based on a specific amount of donation?

$10,000 =
$100,000 =
$250,000 =
$fill in the blank =


This is not a philosophical question.

[golgoj4]

many i would imagine.

-golgoj4

[Esperanto]

I suppose he's wiling to donate but wants to know what can be done for a specified amount. I suppose that once it gets above $100K then people might be considering doing it full time for a while. I have no idea how the money is spend. Maybe it is wise to specify how much you would be willing to donate and have the devs make a proposal what they can reasonably promise to finish in x amount of time for that amount.

[golgoj4]

Honestly, there are lots of things to be done. But its a matter of coordinating with individual developers for targeted stuff that contributes to the larger ecosystem. I dont think a lump donation so much as how much to finish Qorbiter for example

-golgoj4

[davegravy]

Ok but what is the next step in this dialog? Should the donor list the areas of the project he is interested in contributing to, and then devs with matching interests can respond with proposals for work scope and cost?

How do other open source projects handle these sorts of queries?

[Techstyle]

ZaPHoN,

What do you have in Mind?

[PreDeToR_]

Hi Guys

I like the idea of donating for a specific feature.
Although it might/will benefit everybody, donating to have a feature top of the todo list, I think is worth while.

For example:
Improving the build process so that we can upgrade to newer versions of Ubuntu easier, which in-turn allows the system to support more hardware.
MD on screen display/interface(if we get people with the look, we might get more interest in the system and therefore more people to donate/work on it)

I would love to spend time working on the syste, but I simply do not have the time at the moment to be able to help

But for the people that have the time, this might help make it either worth their time or be able to distract them to add a feature the is important to someone else.

Anyway, I would love to hear more from the guys that are actually working on the system dev wize at the moment.

[l3mce]

Hi Guys

I like the idea of donating for a specific feature.
Although it might/will benefit everybody, donating to have a feature top of the todo list, I think is worth while.

For example:
Improving the build process so that we can upgrade to newer versions of Ubuntu easier, which in-turn allows the system to support more hardware.

There is nothing wrong with the build process... the problem is the amount of gears necessary to support the features we have while everything changes upstream. Think of it like this... a project like xbmc has 12 gears, and it tells the time very well. LMCE has 35,000 gears and it handles every measurement of time and space, on land, in space or under water... and when one of those gears breaks it has a ripple effect stopping everything... so almost nothing works until almost everything works. Things are only made to work by being rewritten, and there are like 5 guys writing code.

MD on screen display/interface(if we get people with the look, we might get more interest in the system and therefore more people to donate/work on it)

One of the five guys is working on that.

I would love to spend time working on the syste, but I simply do not have the time at the moment to be able to help

A cop, a priest, and a programmer walk into a bar... stop me if you have heard this before...

But for the people that have the time, this might help make it either worth their time or be able to distract them to add a feature the is important to someone else.

Anyway, I would love to hear more from the guys that are actually working on the system dev wize at the moment.

Yes. I want your money.

Before anything like this was setup, there would have to be an approval panel, indicating when milestones were reached, or if it is an all or nothing scenario... when it was "done"... how many bugs can be expected... and someone would have to deal with the complaints and varying levels of dissatisfaction etc. If people are incentivized to do projects, they will not upload their code until it is finished, or there will be squabbling if someone corrects/adds to it... If it is milestone based, people will not ever complete the end result... It sounds like a nightmare to me...

But yes... I want your money.

[jamo]

There is nothing wrong with the build process...

L3, have you seen uplink's comments on the sticky thread at the top regarding the build process... your thoughts on that? Is he on the wrong track there?

A cop, a priest, and a programmer walk into a bar... stop me if you have heard this before...

I haven't, please post the rest ;-)

Yes. I want your money.

Pity the original poster seems to have bailed from the discussion. I do think it's a very interesting discussion and the points you (L3mce) raise are equally valid. Financial considerations have a way of focussing things that can misdirect and apply all the wrong incentives... but surely there is potential for it to be a positive thing just in terms of assisting with resourcing. Would like to see more discussion on it.

Before anything like this was setup, there would have to be an approval panel, indicating when milestones were reached, or if it is an all or nothing scenario... when it was "done"... how many bugs can be expected... and someone would have to deal with the complaints and varying levels of dissatisfaction etc. If people are incentivized to do projects, they will not upload their code until it is finished, or there will be squabbling if someone corrects/adds to it... If it is milestone based, people will not ever complete the end result... It sounds like a nightmare to me...

But yes... I want your money.

Please shoot down in flames... I'm very very new to linuxmce, the community etc so I'm sure I will have the culture all wrong... but would it be so bad if there were a mechanism by which someone could "buy" a dev's time to work on a particular feature that would assist them and the agreement/arrangement could be purely between the dev(s) involved and the user. There could be some basic principles, for example, that any code generated is free and open to all when done and that the user who paid cannot object if it is later modified or changed as part of LMCE (they can always fork their own bit if they don't like that or whatever). Then the agreement is really just between the individual parties and only the dev(s) and users involved worry about whether the end result meets the requirement.
Could something like that not allow some devs to potentially set aside more time than they currently do because now they could be remunerated for that extra time? And hopefully the very simple and basic rules like I suggested would mean that the things that get done are not *bad* for the project.... they're just things that might not have been at the top of the priority list otherwise... so they actually contribute to the project overall AND allow for extra resourcing because devs are able to commit more time overall due to the remuneration possibility. Maybe, it would even incentivise more people to get involved in development, realising if they skilled up appropriately, they could potentially be compensated for their time?

Just thoughts ;-)

Big thanks to all the devs for their awesome contribution of time. Certainly the last thing I would like to see is the open nature of this amazing project being compromised. But it is possibly something that coudl be discussed.

[JaseP]

It would be nice to have a system to earmark donations for specific work, and also allow for general funding... Bylaws can be set up for funnelling portions of earmarked donations towards the whole, too (kind of a general LinuxMCE "tax" on earmarked donations). Just a thought.

[ZaPHoN]

Haven't bailed.

Reading digesting and thinking.
My thoughts so far.


Aside from taking the steps Dianemo has there must be a way to stage, allow freelance application and monitoring.

Seeing what Asterisk, OpenERP and Ubuntu have achieved in their ecosystems it strikes me as not being impossible to meet paid milestones.

The reason I originally suggested this in the first place is to try and funnel some money into a LMC ecosystem with results similar to or exceeding that of Dianemo.

For example, I know of a few home security and automation specialists that serve residential, commercial and government clients. They are keenly interested in where LMC is heading and wish something like Dianemo was available in North America with the exception of offering UPB as well.

Please continue as I believe this is a very healthy topic of discussion that could only benefit the future of LMC if this topic would evolve into reality.

[davegravy]

I'm trying to get graphic designers (including friends and family) interested in helping with the skinning for qorbiter. Unlike the programming world there doesn't seem to be a pool of designers interested in volunteering their services to a project like this, as designers seem to be approached daily for these things and have a hard enough time making ends meat without these time sinks.

 golgoj's efforts at getting a competition going are valiant and hopefully they bear fruit. If we had a donation scheme in place however, a grand or two in fees could get us what we're looking for.

I suppose I'm advocating the spelling out of what the community (or devs) feel the project NEEDS, and giving donors the option of donating towards those goals.

[golgoj4]

I'm trying to get graphic designers (including friends and family) interested in helping with the skinning for qorbiter. Unlike the programming world there doesn't seem to be a pool of designers interested in volunteering their services to a project like this, as designers seem to be approached daily for these things and have a hard enough time making ends meat without these time sinks.

 golgoj's efforts at getting a competition going are valiant and hopefully they bear fruit. If we had a donation scheme in place however, a grand or two in fees could get us what we're looking for.

I suppose I'm advocating the spelling out of what the community (or devs) feel the project NEEDS, and giving donors the option of donating towards those goals.

Please note that the following is MY personal list of things I HAVE to do or I will consider my contributions to linuxmce incomplete. There is no timeline for completion. Much of its in my head. By opting to go with qOrbiter, i bit off a rather large piece and im still chewing

*On screen web browser
*media playback on phone
*voice commands
*kinect integration
*better upnp integration
*torrent integration
*social network integration

and thats off the top of my head...

[Marie.O]

I do invest time into LinuxMCE. I invest LOTS of time into LinuxMCE. But I do it on MY rules. I start something, let it sit for a while, and maybe or maybe not continue it. I don't spend time on LinuxMCE for money. I spend time on LinuxMCE for fun. And as I have said a few milleniums ago on whether or not I want to become a professional sportsmen, I say it now for LinuxMCE. I am in it for the fun. As soon as money gets involved, there are obligations. I already have obligations outside of LinuxMCE, and don't want to have additional obligations.

Some dev's do it for money apart from the fun prospect. If you want to get something specific done, go and approach TSchak. He has shown his great work in the past, both paid for and free work. This is something that works. But don't expect to get by with peanuts. Developing for someone else costs time. This time needs to be paid for. And the hourly rate doesn't get lower because it is for LinuxMCE.

[bongowongo]

But this is not new.
If I am not mistaken there where special projects where you could pay TSCHAK and he will do it.
But I agree with possy that for the majority this project is a hobby, the fun factor should still be there.
 
We would have to find a modus where we can do both.