Author Topic: Ceton cableCARD tuner  (Read 8580 times)

kyfalcon

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Ceton cableCARD tuner
« on: September 11, 2009, 06:01:48 pm »
Did anyone see engadget yesterday talk about the CETON cableCARD tuner? 4 HD tuners on one mini-PCI. I went to there site and couldn't find any ino on whether they had a llinux driver or not. It seems that they have them for other devices using the same chip set. This would be a great way to bring live tv into linuxMCE.

Meldawn

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Re: Ceton cableCARD tuner
« Reply #1 on: December 02, 2009, 06:20:32 pm »
I know this is an old thread but I think it is too important to ignore. I have sent a couple emails to the company asking if there will be Linux support and have not got a response. If the LinuxMCE community starts sending emails they will see that there is support for the product, they might give some additional info on the card.

Here is a link to the company.

http://www.cetoncorp.com/ProductsWMC.php

I will update if I hear back from them.

tschak909

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Re: Ceton cableCARD tuner
« Reply #2 on: December 02, 2009, 07:36:36 pm »
...

guys,

there is no protected media path, no DRM path for Linux.

There will be NO support of _ANY_ OCURs. NONE. ZERO. NOT GONNA HAPPEN. EVER.

Every six months these threads pop up, and every six months, I have to explain this. It's not our fault, write your congressmen.

-Thom

Meldawn

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Re: Ceton cableCARD tuner
« Reply #3 on: December 02, 2009, 10:01:26 pm »
If what i am hearing you say is true then how does one go about watching a digital cable service in the States? Also, what operating system do appliances like TiVo use?

tschak909

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Re: Ceton cableCARD tuner
« Reply #4 on: December 02, 2009, 10:09:30 pm »
You can only use devices that can tune and demodulate the raw QAM256 signals, such as the HDHomeRun.

This does not include many channels on cable providers, as many of them (especially the HD channels) are ENCRYPTED, and require conditional access modules (CAM) to decrypt them.

In the case of CableCARD, one of the REQUIRED stipulations for CableCARD compliance, is a rigourous certification process which tests protected data paths within the decryption subsystems of a given reciever device. This means, that the underlying operating systems and their media stacks must provide working DRM in compliance with the standards that CableLabs has set forward, which have been approved by those that CableLabs answers to, namely, Hollywood, and the individual channel networks.

With the TiVO, while they are using the Linux kernel, their entire media stack is locked down by DRM, and can not be manipulated, patched, or extended in any way, the entire data path has been deemed to be "secure" by CableLabs.

But, you would KNOW this, if you ACTUALLY DUG IN, AND USED __GOOGLE__ FOR MORE THAN FIVE MINUTES. Everybody is affected by this. Windows, Linux, MacOS, doesn't matter.

These devices require an underlying operating system that does everything in its power to prevent the user from copying the resulting unencrypted stream, once it has passed through the CAM. A desktop Linux distribution does not have this, LinuxMCE does not have this, therefore we can not, and will not ever support these devices.

Please, do some research.

-Thom

Meldawn

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Re: Ceton cableCARD tuner
« Reply #5 on: December 02, 2009, 10:33:39 pm »
ok.. well.. If you look a the number of posts I have made you would see that I am in fact new to LinuxMCE. I see it as a great system with a lot of potential. There are many things about the process that I do not understand and the only way to understand is to ask questions.

If you are so jaded to the process then do us all a favor and DON'T REPLY!

I'm sure there is some other user that would be willing to give a couple of new users some direction. If there is an other user that would be willing to have a civilized conversation with someone that wants to learn, please send me a private message.

Thom,
   I hope someone hugs you soon. It sounds like you need it.

kyfalcon

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Re: Ceton cableCARD tuner
« Reply #6 on: December 02, 2009, 10:41:36 pm »
Thom, maybe I misread the press release but it sounded like the whole DRM issue was relaxed. Part of the old cableCard process was that it was only an OEM solution, but now anyone can buy these cards and build their own systems. In fact I think I read somewhere else that Ceton has another card using the same chips that they have linux drivers for. If this is ever going to be the whole house solution multiple HD TV thru something other than an HDHomeRun is going to be a necesity.

skeptic

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Re: Ceton cableCARD tuner
« Reply #7 on: December 02, 2009, 11:35:03 pm »
Thom, maybe I misread the press release but it sounded like the whole DRM issue was relaxed. Part of the old cableCard process was that it was only an OEM solution, but now anyone can buy these cards and build their own systems. In fact I think I read somewhere else that Ceton has another card using the same chips that they have linux drivers for.
Not so sound skeptical, but links?  While I'd love for this to be the case, and from the outside looking in it seems a better business model, but I have my doubts.  If there was a cablecard capable tuner that worked with LMCE and comcast I'd  buy one on the spot, as would several others.  However, as Thom mentioned above, until the DRM requirements go away this just isn't possible.
Quote
If this is ever going to be the whole house solution multiple HD TV thru something other than an HDHomeRun is going to be a necesity.

I'm not following what you are saying.  If you are saying HDHR will not work for a multiple MD setup with HD, you are incorrect.  Or more specifically, it depends on the cable company and what channels you are referring to.  For the moment at least, I have Comcast and I'm able to get several HD stations through HDHR.  In fact, they keep adding more unencrypted digital stations and I have very few programs that still get recorded on my old analog tuner.  Granted, this doesn't work for premium stations as those are encrypted, but I get all the major networks and a number of other stations in digital.  HD vs SD (both in digital) still seems to be station and/or program specific but that wouldn't change with a CableCard setup. 


skeptic

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Re: Ceton cableCARD tuner
« Reply #9 on: December 03, 2009, 01:04:29 am »
Just read both links - no mention of anything other than it being a non-OEM card (ie - can buy separate not just with a PC) for Windows Media Center.  With the requirement for CableLabs approval process I seriously doubt there will be any Linux options. 

kyfalcon

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Re: Ceton cableCARD tuner
« Reply #10 on: December 03, 2009, 03:10:56 pm »
It mentioned in another thread that the DRM was being relaxed. I guess it just depends on how much it is relaxed. I'll try to find it.

skeptic

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Re: Ceton cableCARD tuner
« Reply #11 on: December 03, 2009, 03:58:25 pm »
It mentioned in another thread that the DRM was being relaxed. I guess it just depends on how much it is relaxed. I'll try to find it.
I saw that as well, but nothing specific and I took it to really mean allowing the card to be sold separately.

tschak909

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Re: Ceton cableCARD tuner
« Reply #12 on: December 03, 2009, 04:00:07 pm »
to clarify, just because you can buy them separate for Windows MCE systems does not mean there will ever be drivers for Linux. The pieces required to pass CableLabs certification are not part of the Linux kernel, nor will they ever be.

-Thom

kyfalcon

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Re: Ceton cableCARD tuner
« Reply #13 on: December 03, 2009, 05:01:06 pm »
Never is a strong word Thom. Some clever individual could always re-engineer one :)

tschak909

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Re: Ceton cableCARD tuner
« Reply #14 on: December 03, 2009, 05:22:19 pm »
and wind up in jail, thanks to the DMCA.

I will not mention this again, and any further posts suggesting this will be deleted, WE DO NOT CONDONE THE TALK OF CIRCUMVENTION TECHNOLOGY ON THIS FORUM.

Thank you,
-Thom