Author Topic: Here we go - Pluto started but quite some of features dead  (Read 7172 times)

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Here we go - Pluto started but quite some of features dead
« on: March 09, 2005, 11:09:03 am »
Hi,

I've installed and setup Pluto home but have some newbie problems and questions:
- Motion : I have put Hauppage WinTV in computer (I yet don't have proper video capture card) for video surveillance (use the composite input, where surveillance cam is connnected).

- Where are configuration files for motion, to see how to set it up ?
- I have also some USB cams I'm really satisfied with quality (Quickam PRO 4000). If I may suggest adding support also for those cameras with pwc module - I had motion running with this module and usb webcam (in Linux world almost all supported webcams are on pwc or ovxxx modules) ... This support will also be good for video conferencing.

- Hybrid Media director:
- I wonder how to add media files to Pluto (are there any samba shares that could be used?) Should I add more users ?
- I've slide in DVD but it won't play. Where are appropriate logs to take a look what happened ?
- How is IR remote control set up ? I have ATI wireless remote wonder - it was detected OK, but don't know where to look for related files...


- Mobile orbiter
- it looks nice, but some texts are hardly readable. I guess this comes from resizing of GUI pictures. Are there any better settings to solve this ?

- How to troubleshoot Pluto in general ? Logs, debugs, etc...


- Debian Sarge
Whoooh, I have quite some problems with HW detection and set up. Also shutdown is not made properly (machine still consumes 80 Watts after it says power off). Hercules Digifire card was crashing Pluto installation (now after it is installed, I can put it back in).
I've just clicked on pictures and Media director crashed (it's trying to run X, but it just won't go)... How to restart Orbiter ?

- How to enable Pluto as Firewall (2 network cards) ?

I guess doing Sarge and Pluto on different HW configs is little bit adventureous. Do you have any HW recomendations to go along ?

I have Asus p4p800-e Deluxe, but it seems like it is not love on first sight with Debian Sarge...

Sorry, I probably sound a little disapointed, but will try to get over this newbie problems. Thanks for great work - I hope it will work for me either...

Regards,

Rob.

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Re: Here we go - Pluto started but quite some of features de
« Reply #1 on: March 10, 2005, 10:37:09 am »
Quote from: "tinia"
Hi,

I've installed and setup Pluto home but have some newbie problems and questions:
- Motion : I have put Hauppage WinTV in computer (I yet don't have proper video capture card) for video surveillance (use the composite input, where surveillance cam is connnected).

- Where are configuration files for motion, to see how to set it up ?


/etc/motion/motion.conf. I had to change it to suit WinTV PCI and camera on composite input. Can I solve this problem for all future Pluto users with generating device template? How ?

Necessary changes were :
input 1
norm 0     (it's for PAL)
frequency 0


Quote from: "tinia"
- I have also some USB cams I'm really satisfied with quality (Quickam PRO 4000). If I may suggest adding support also for those cameras with pwc module - I had motion running with this module and usb webcam (in Linux world almost all supported webcams are on pwc or ovxxx modules) ... This support will also be good for video conferencing.


This suggestion still stands and I guess it's easy solvable. I just don't know how to generate proper templates and additional motion configuration needed. This is where Pluto comes to test ...

Quote from: "tinia"
- Hybrid Media director:
- I wonder how to add media files to Pluto (are there any samba shares that could be used?) Should I add more users ?
- I've slide in DVD but it won't play. Where are appropriate logs to take a look what happened ?
- How is IR remote control set up ? I have ATI wireless remote wonder - it was detected OK, but don't know where to look for related files...

I guess adding users still doesn't function properly - I've added some users, but nothing happend (no new shares, home directories, etc...).
For remotes - LIRC is in action. Will take a look later...


Quote from: "tinia"
- Mobile orbiter
- it looks nice, but some texts are hardly readable. I guess this comes from resizing of GUI pictures. Are there any better settings to solve this ?


I will add some more questions:
- Mobile orbiter is now connecting to Pluto via Bluetooth. What do I need to be able to connect over GPRS ?

Quote from: "tinia"
- How to troubleshoot Pluto in general ? Logs, debugs, etc...


/var/log/pluto ...


Quote from: "tinia"
- Debian Sarge
Whoooh, I have quite some problems with HW detection and set up. Also shutdown is not made properly (machine still consumes 80 Watts after it says power off). Hercules Digifire card was crashing Pluto installation (now after it is installed, I can put it back in).
I've just clicked on pictures and Media director crashed (it's trying to run X, but it just won't go)... How to restart Orbiter ?

- How to enable Pluto as Firewall (2 network cards) ?

I have two cards in it, but would like to use Firewall in reverse order of cards - can I change that (Now , I'm forced to use Gigabit card for outside - ADSL and 100Mb on inner network - but would like to switch them...).


Quote from: "tinia"

I guess doing Sarge and Pluto on different HW configs is little bit adventureous. Do you have any HW recomendations to go along ?

I have Asus p4p800-e Deluxe, but it seems like it is not love on first sight with Debian Sarge...

Sorry, I probably sound a little disapointed, but will try to get over this newbie problems. Thanks for great work - I hope it will work for me either...

Regards,

Rob.  


Regards,

Rob.

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« Reply #2 on: March 12, 2005, 02:38:34 pm »
I'm not familiar with motion, but I asked someone else to respond to it.

I filed a bug report with a programmer (Radu) about the users issue.  It should add those automatically.

Regarding the mobile orbiter, when you're not in the house, click the 'menu' button and choose Pluto MO.  That will show you the "VMC" files.  A VMC is essentially like a mini application, similar to a flash file.  When you're at home, the system automatically creates an 'away.vmc' that has menus to control the stuff in your home.  You can choose away.vmc to bring up the menu, and as you choose items, they're sent over whatever internet connection your phone has (gprs) to the server.

We're working on the cosmetics for the phone.  

Under Advanced, Devices, when you choose the Core, there is a device data which has the network settings.  You should be able to change that on the network settings page.  I'll send a bug report to the php guy.

The ripping functions aren't implemented yet.  You will be able to just put the disc in and chooes 'copy'.  In the meantime, it should have created samba shares for the users.  In /home/public/data is the public share (everyone shares that media), and /home/users_X/data for each user's private media.

Check the DVD logs in /var/log/pluto/*Xine*.newlog and also in /var/log/pluto/*dvd*.

Pluto doesn't ship with a dvd css decryptor.  But as open source, some users have included instructions on adding dvdcss:
newbielink:http://www.geocities.com/download2kx01/ [nonactive]

You may also need to a check the region your drive is set to.

Regarding debugging, in addition to the logs, core dumps are in /usr/pluto/coredumps.  If you look at the /var/log/pluto_deviceid log file, you'll see all the devices as they're being spawned.  If any device crashes, it will automatically respawn it.  See /usr/pluto/bin/Spawn_Device.sh.

Sorry about the Debian issues.  There's not much we can do.  As we get closer to release we'll have "certified compatible" hardware that is known to work without issues.

We use another model of the Asus p4p800 and it works.  The only big problem is usually with SATA drives and non-legacy mode.  There's a "Linux Compatible" web site that has more info on compatible hardware.
There's an advanced Firewall page for the firewall.

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Motion related
« Reply #3 on: March 17, 2005, 08:51:55 am »
Hello, i have fixed the problem with the motion, the bigest problem it was the incorect spelling of the frequency  :oops: . I know i have a bad english, and so far for the input option in the motion config file, i have added a new parameter, for that when creating a new device ... it will require the Input Type (as a number) the Video Type (as a number <- this was a string until now and it was wrong). I don't know for sure how fast my changes will propagate, but i hope you will get the new motion related soft soon.

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Re: Motion related
« Reply #4 on: March 17, 2005, 11:32:24 am »
Quote from: "dan.h"
Hello, i have fixed the problem with the motion, the bigest problem it was the incorect spelling of the frequency  :oops: . I know i have a bad english, and so far for the input option in the motion config file, i have added a new parameter, for that when creating a new device ... it will require the Input Type (as a number) the Video Type (as a number <- this was a string until now and it was wrong). I don't know for sure how fast my changes will propagate, but i hope you will get the new motion related soft soon.


I'd like to discuss some more about motion and Pluto. There are some important points that needs to be solved :

1. main /etc/motion/motion.conf

That file could be written with some default data, but what is more important it has to include #thread conf files for each thread for motion.
Devices that are threads to motion are :
- usb camera
- analog capture card (with 1 or more inputs)
- net camera ? (i'm not sure about that cause I'm not using them)

I'm not sure how to deal with this and templates. USB cam template should be something like analog capture card, ...

2. other config option for motion

I guess it would be wise to incorporate some other config possibilities that can be specified overall and for each thread separately (filters, screen texts, picture size, etc...). That could certainly be next step. Partially it could be dealt also in templates, where best settings for each device could be found, but screen texts could be left to user to change some prepared default values (cam1, cam2 ....) ...

3. using web server

I know that main remote control device is Orbiter or Media director. But I guess having some basic web interface would also be beneficial... Motion has already built in web streaming server and has several web interfaces that are in work, so I guess it would't be bad to include...

4. How to properly add device(device template) to Pluto

I'd be glad if I can help in adding usb cam support to Pluto. But since there are no easy documents how to do that, I'd kindly ask for some guidance here, and will document procedure for the rest of bunch going same way.

Since usb cam template won't be much different from analog_capture_card what is better way to add template :
- edit existing analog_capture_card
- add template/generate/ etc...

When template is ready it can be compiled. What are next steps to add it in Pluto system, to appear in web interface ? What to do to share with other Pluto users ?


Thanks in advance for answers,

regards,

Rob.

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Motion related reply
« Reply #5 on: March 17, 2005, 12:16:21 pm »
1) on first issue, it suports thread in config file, and this is done when adding a new Capture Cammera. When adding a Capture Card all thread are commented, and when the user ads a new Capture Camera that will controled by the Capture Card, it will modify the config file adding a thread for every capture camera. When creating a new Capture Card device, it comes with some default values. That are in the database, and are showed when creating that device, so the motion config file is filled with those default values if the user do not modify them.

2) On the options for the cammera, i agree with you on the next step we will implement filters, picture size, screen text and so on.

3) About this issue is not related to me, because it's not my job the web page, but i will relay this issue to the one that is taking care of the web part. If you are reffering to the fact that you would like to access the motion web streaming server from a remote location, this will be solved fast and easy, modifing the firewall.

4)About the device template issue, this could be solved like that. There are few steps that if you follow them you will make a driver fast and easy. First you click on Device Template from the web interface, select a category and a manufacturer and add a new device template. Edit the template Device Data that represents the parameters that a device will receive when created and runned. Modify the commands that suports, and their parameters. After finishing the device template. Then go where you have the binarys and run DCEGen -d <device template number> and/or with other options. This will create a project with source code and headers for your devicetemplate. Using the project implement what you whant you driver to do. Build it and run it. About the issue of propagation to other users.. hmm this i don't know..

If you are interested in more details creating a device template and/or a device, i will gladly guide you.

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Re: Motion related reply
« Reply #6 on: March 17, 2005, 01:57:30 pm »
Hi,

thanks for prompt response. I have some comments below:

Quote from: "dan.h"
1) on first issue, it suports thread in config file, and this is done when adding a new Capture Cammera. When adding a Capture Card all thread are commented, and when the user ads a new Capture Camera that will controled by the Capture Card, it will modify the config file adding a thread for every capture camera. When creating a new Capture Card device, it comes with some default values. That are in the database, and are showed when creating that device, so the motion config file is filled with those default values if the user do not modify them.

So I guees that usb web camera (that is its own /dev/video device) should behave similar to analog capture card (but only one device instead of 4) and create separate thread file for it...

Quote from: "dan.h"

4)About the device template issue, this could be solved like that. There are few steps that if you follow them you will make a driver fast and easy. First you click on Device Template from the web interface, select a category and a manufacturer and add a new device template. Edit the template Device Data that represents the parameters that a device will receive when created and runned. Modify the commands that suports, and their parameters. After finishing the device template. Then go where you have the binarys and run DCEGen -d <device template number> and/or with other options. This will create a project with source code and headers for your devicetemplate. Using the project implement what you whant you driver to do. Build it and run it. About the issue of propagation to other users.. hmm this i don't know..

If you are interested in more details creating a device template and/or a device, i will gladly guide you.  


Is there any possibility to clone some device template and start  from there? I guess some device templates (for instance web cams) will be quite similar, so it would be good to have option to create new template out of existing...  

Ok, I'l take your word for guidance:
I'd like to add usb web cam template that will create separate thread in motion.conf where I can specify /dev/videox device. I guess everything else (picture directory etc...) will be handled automatically.

So question is:
- should I start looking analog_capture_card template and learn from there ?
- what are crucial parameters for motion devices - cameras ?

Thanks in advance,

regards,

Rob.

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« Reply #7 on: March 17, 2005, 02:18:21 pm »
Hello again. Yes usb should behaive simmilar, but the Capture Card does not suport usb cam's yet.

I don't know if there is any method to clone a device template.

Quote
Ok, I'l take your word for guidance:
I'd like to add usb web cam template that will create separate thread in motion.conf where I can specify /dev/videox device. I guess everything else (picture directory etc...) will be handled automatically.


As i sad if you whant to work with usb cameras, i never tested with the Analog Capture Card device, i think you may need to build a template the will be alike Analog Capture Card, but for USB cameras, and then build a template for USB cammeras. Ass about the options, that depends on you what they will be, because I, in the Capture Card Template i write the options what i consder to be default, you will never know what defaults are in the motion config file.

Yes you should look into the Generic Analog Capture Card template and source code and inspire from there. This would help you I think.

I think that the most important options for a video divice, is the device option, the video type option and number of cammeras. I hope you understood what i sad in here :)

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« Reply #8 on: March 18, 2005, 08:05:51 am »
Hi,

I have quick questions about analog_capture_card - maybe I understood sources wrong, but would like to clear this out:
- analog_capture_card overwrites /etc/motion/motion.conf if it finds one. What if there are two cards in system? I guess they will write over each other so only one will remain ?

- I guess that something else should write generic motion.conf, and all devices should only add threads (analog capture card 4, usb and ip cams 1). Simple solution would be to have default motion.conf already and then just add threads for devices.... Or if motion.conf exists, it will only add threads...

- Where could I find code for IP cameras ? Can they exist by themselves (do they write their own motion.conf) ?

Am I wrong in my understanding ?


Regards,

Rob.

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« Reply #9 on: March 18, 2005, 08:45:57 am »
Helo,

Yes it will overwrite the file, and on one system it will be only one capture card, and this is because all the child cameras of the card are controled via the card, and that means that only one card should have control over the motion.conf. This could be fixed as you said using thread option, but imagine more than one device controling the main motion config in the same time, it would be disaster. The only viable solution would be to make a Wrapper for the motion server, and then all the capture devices will be controled by the wrapper, and this way only one device will have to deal with the motion configs. About IP cameras i don't know anything. If you find out something, please let us know. You are not wrong in your understanding.  :wink:

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« Reply #10 on: March 18, 2005, 11:45:30 am »
Quote from: "radu.c"
Helo,

Yes it will overwrite the file, and on one system it will be only one capture card, and this is because all the child cameras of the card are controled via the card, and that means that only one card should have control over the motion.conf. This could be fixed as you said using thread option, but imagine more than one device controling the main motion config in the same time, it would be disaster. The only viable solution would be to make a Wrapper for the motion server, and then all the capture devices will be controled by the wrapper, and this way only one device will have to deal with the motion configs. About IP cameras i don't know anything. If you find out something, please let us know. You are not wrong in your understanding.  :wink:


Hi,

thanks for info. Please don't get me wrong, I don't want to pressure you in any kind of different thinking - just giving my opinions in positive manner.

Drawback of analog_capture_card is that most of cards control 4 inputs (some of them only 1 like wintv) - so situation with more cards in same system is not so unusual (also I have system where usb cameras and analog are used in motion). I still think that this will be easier to deal now, than later, when support will expand to other devices...

I still think that motion.conf is not such problem. It could just be there in default manner from the start. All devices added would just add their own threads instead of overwritting whole motion.conf... If any devices are in system, then motion is started, otherwise not. But motion.conf could be there....

I probably am missing something, but there are some problems ahead:
- what if I want to have only USB camera - in this case:
  a. I need analog_capture card to write motion.conf
  b. write own motion.conf - but that will overwrite any other motion.conf from other devices.

I still think that writting motion.conf from devices is not so good idea for motion.conf, cause it's dead container, where threads are added for each device....

Hope this helps a little bit,

regards,

Rob.

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« Reply #11 on: March 18, 2005, 12:15:04 pm »
The motion module is by no means complete.  It's really just a tiny wrapper 1 programmer wrote in a couple of days to get the cameras working.  Admittedly it will need to be re-thought.  Normally, we're promoting users buy IP based cameras instead--much cleaner solution.  But, we will need a better solution for Motion.

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« Reply #12 on: March 18, 2005, 12:51:28 pm »
Quote from: "aaron.b"
The motion module is by no means complete.  It's really just a tiny wrapper 1 programmer wrote in a couple of days to get the cameras working.  Admittedly it will need to be re-thought.  Normally, we're promoting users buy IP based cameras instead--much cleaner solution.  But, we will need a better solution for Motion.


I'd like to cooperate, cause would like to add usb cam support. But I guess it would be better that actual changes are performed by your guys.

I guess that proposed way (devices write only threads to existing default motion.conf) would be a fast start, so we can add support for other devices quickly - each one will just add thread.conf file for its own and that's it.

I'd modifiy analog_capture_card to just add threads and leave motion.conf as default file in /etc/motion...

I guess that would be cleaner start, but I could be wrong (as always :-) )...

I have another small question:
- if I add Device template, generate project and compile it. What do I have to do to use this device on local system and what to share with other pluto users ?

Thanks,

regards,

Rob.

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« Reply #13 on: March 18, 2005, 01:05:23 pm »
Regarding sharing the new devices you create....  You can do whatever you like with motion and the analog capture card, including something else that suits you better.  We haven't put effort into this module at all since our focus is exclusively on the media at this point.

To share new devices you create, you first tell us the name of the project.  We'll set you up with svn access to that directory.  When you're ready, we can include that module in our automated build process.

You will also need to do sqlCVS -r dce checkin

which checks in the tables in the DCE repository on your local machine.  That includes the sql table for DeviceTemplate and so on, which define the device, the commands, etc.

Whenever you make changes to the device templates, you're modifying your local copy of the database.  After the sqwlCVS checkin, you will be given a batch number, which contains all your changes to the database.

You just give us your batch number, and then one of us 'approves' it, which merges it in to the master database.

Usually we found that once you setup the device, there are very few changes to the database (ie the structure), and it's mostly just code changes checked in with svn.

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« Reply #14 on: March 25, 2005, 06:08:11 pm »
Since pluto is using OSS solutions, have you looked at ZoneMinder to handle the camera survelliance part of pluto?  It supports quite a few cameras out of the box and has quite a few other things that Im sure users of pluto would want.  Just a thought.