Author Topic: help newbe warning!!  (Read 1868 times)

gazzzman

  • Veteran
  • ***
  • Posts: 118
    • View Profile
help newbe warning!!
« on: March 07, 2008, 12:56:09 am »
not sure where to start really!!
hi everyone!
you are doing great things here!

I caught a certain video on youtube a couple of weeks ago (you know the one :) )
now.. I am pretty new to linux so please bear with me :)
I have ran Bill gates version$ (all of them) and after seeing THAT clip I was inspired to try Linuxmce!
now I don't mean to be critical (I really don't I REALLY appreciate the amount of work everyone has done both in this project and in Linux in general) I use PClinux OS and Dream Linux quite a lot (as well as running BQ Servers etc)
so I suppose I am spoiled a bit by the stability and completeness of these!
so here goes!
installed Linuxmce on a spare P4 2GHz with 1GB of RAM and a reasonable video card..
then (after following the tutorial) turned off the DHCP on my router and installed it again (I couldn't get the DHCP server to start on the first install lol!)
then I set up a MD.. so far so good!
got it to talk to the rest of the network and the media catalouging was great!!
now things started to take a turn for the worse!
I sort of hoped my cm15 would work.. you know "out of the box" (if I find that guy I am going to give him a SLAP!)
of course it didn't work that way so I put that asside for now and went and bought 2 hauppage usb2 dvb-t tuners..
after reading for hours about dvb utils I finally got one of the tuners to scan and create a channel list!
(the fact the other one wont is a bit of a mystery right now :)  )
installed VDRadmin and followed the tutorial in the wiki..
but as soon as I start VDR it stops again!
no error (that I can see anyhow)
I won't even mention.. I cannot pair either of my bluetooth phones with the core as the seems to be no way to recipricate in the mating ritual :) (passkey)
and after reading the wikki I am uncertain whether I should try to "mate" my wm6 phone via bluetooth at all!
my s60 phone just balks at the passkey!
now it won't play DVD's (not even the ones I ripped earlier) saying dss is not installed (though it says it is in he interface)
2 and a half weeks on and I am losing all my hair lol!
sorry for this super long winded post!!
but I really want to SLAP that guy :)
the biggest difficulty for a moron like me is knowing at what stage things really are at...
that is to say..
what really works and what might work in beta 6 :)
please forgive this howl of anguish!
I DO realise just how much work is going on!!!!
really..
the real question should be:
am I out of my depth?
..
to give you an idea I have been a TV engineer for the last 25 years..
I have A+ network+ and ccna
but I have very little expierence in nix :(
having arrived here via the Gates school of philosophy :)
I really want to mend my ways! but just how deep is it going to get?
anyway!
I think I have stuffed it again (another install??)
as in desperation before I did an apt-get upgrade-distro (or whatever :) )
anyone game enough to tell me where to go from here?
of and do I need to reinstall again (time 4)
still!
I feel like a close personal friend of Sarah (the name given to my core too!!)
and I am spending that much timne with her my wife thinks Sarah is a real girl lol!
again!
sorry for this super long winded post!
I am looking for help and more than a little encouragement/moral support :)
lastly..
if I want to continue with the home automation side of things..
do I have to look for a cm11?
or can I use my cm15?
I would love to use Zwave but the UK prices!!
$120 for the PC interface and about $75 per interface I think they are having a laugh!
I have converted a fair bit of my X10 stuff to 240 V mains so I could be ready to go with that :)
again thanks for reading!
and if any of you guys (or galls) see that guy that did the video on youtube would you give him a slap for me please :)
Garry
 
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version 3.1
GCC@GE@GIT@GO dpu S-: a+ C+++ L++ E-- W+++ N+ o+++ w-- O M+ PS+++ PE-- Y++
PGP+ t++ 5 X++ R- tv b+ DI++ D---- G e++* h*++ r+++ Y++++
-----END GEEK CODE BLOCK-----

orionsune

  • Veteran
  • ***
  • Posts: 133
    • View Profile
Re: help newbe warning!!
« Reply #1 on: March 07, 2008, 01:34:10 am »
For starters you are not alone, I too experienced lmce the way you have.  Granted i'm an experienced linux user.

Out of the box?  bullcrap.. lol I double LOL on anyone who claims so.  Even if we have the right hardware... just take a look at the forum index, there is proof enough.  Anyways, i'm not here to bash lmce because I use it on a daily basis and love the hell out of it, although I agree, maybe that guy needs to stop LYING on video... lol

Anyways...

I think I can help with one, maybe two issues...
Quote
now it won't play DVD's (not even the ones I ripped earlier) saying dss is not installed (though it says it is in he interface)
I had this problem also, even though it's listed under the "add software" section, and says "installed" int he right corner of that item... I clicked on it from the add software section and it appeared to have re-installed itself and my dvd's started working again.  It hasn't broken since.


The best suggestion I have for you is the way I went about building my lmce.  First, I see you have plenty of issues to go around.  So did I, I chose the most desirable of the issues, in my case, I couldn't get network shares to detect properly and that was the feature I most wanted to use... so I concentrated on just that, and asked questions pertainingly to only that problem, until I was able to solve it, then move on.  Asking too many questions all at once kind of scares these guys off...

Quote
having arrived here via the Gates school of philosophy Smiley
I would be careful who I tell this too, your likely to be mobbed... just joking.
entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem

gazzzman

  • Veteran
  • ***
  • Posts: 118
    • View Profile
Re: help newbe warning!!
« Reply #2 on: March 07, 2008, 02:11:28 am »
hi there!
thanks orionsune!
I was beggining to think it was just me :)
yes I love what I have seen thus far !
though I think people who try to sell this on ebay or try to tell you that everything just works "out of the box"
are probably going to wreck it for a lot of folks :(
and that is a real shame!!
I would have gone in a lot different if I had not seen that video lol!
anyways.. thanks for the info on the DVD software :) that was a nice easy fix!
next I think it is going to be finding out who killed VDR!
though TBH I don't know if I would be better getting a hauppage 150 analog capture card and using it with mythtv and my dreambox instead :)
(does the M$ ir sender work?
so that I could change channels on the dreambox!
ah decisions decisions :)
still..
I managed to get my Raq's running strongbolt with mailscanner and spamassassin (after a month or two lol)
so I live in hope!!!
again orionsune thanks for your swift reply!
it's a nice feeling to know I am not alone :)
(me and Sarah lol!)
cheers
Garry
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version 3.1
GCC@GE@GIT@GO dpu S-: a+ C+++ L++ E-- W+++ N+ o+++ w-- O M+ PS+++ PE-- Y++
PGP+ t++ 5 X++ R- tv b+ DI++ D---- G e++* h*++ r+++ Y++++
-----END GEEK CODE BLOCK-----

colinjones

  • Alumni
  • LinuxMCE God
  • *
  • Posts: 3003
    • View Profile
Re: help newbe warning!!
« Reply #3 on: March 07, 2008, 03:21:56 am »
Not really the point, guys - but if you have the exact hardware/screen/etc that is used in the video, it will work right out of the box! It does actually say that in the caveats on-screen and verbally, and on the web site I believe. But of course, who has that exact hardware? We just ignore that bit and assume that it isn't as specific as that.... it is, but as long as you aren't trying to re-engineer how the system works, generally it is pretty easy to get going. If you read back through the volumous threads that talk about these issues in the past, you will find that almost all of them are either using a video card that wasn't supported my LMCE or trying to unwind the dual-NIC/DHCP/etc parts of LMCE. You'll also find plenty of people saying that once they accepted the structure it all went easy :)

Use one of the listed video cards (definitely nVidia), a screen that has a wide range of scan frequencies (not just HD!), and wire it up with the as-designed network configuration before you start building, and it will work like a dream ;)

corcorelli

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 4
    • View Profile
Re: help newbe warning!!
« Reply #4 on: March 07, 2008, 12:44:31 pm »
All sounds quite familiar. I've been at this a couple of weeks now and mostly things are working. A lot of this comes down to hardware and I realised something which I'm sure is familiar to linux developers:

Microsoft don't need to worry about hardware compatibility. They expect everyone to make sure their hardware is compatible and the manufacturers either comply or don't sell their stuff.

Apple don't need to worry about hardware compatibility. They make all the hardware and software, if you buy everything from Apple it all works together (and that's the market they aim at).

Linux has neither of these advantages, plus a user base that just loves hooking all kinds of weird hardware up. Generally this is okay, because the problem (the adventurous users) is also the solution. However it does seem to be an endless task for the LMCE team to deliver more hardware compatibility and give that 'works out of the box' experience [success recently on the Hauppauge Nova-T 500, now working immediately with Beta4  :)].

I don't have an answer. I guess users could just buy all their hardware through Fiire, or maybe the project could restrict support to certain hardware. Neither good options if you are aiming at a market of 'traditional' linux users. I did think it worthwhile to identify the (very generic) problem.

BTW, I think LMCE is an awesome product and I have had a great couple of weeks getting it up and running and I will certainly enjoy many further evenings 'tinkering' with my setup.  ;D

Joe

orionsune

  • Veteran
  • ***
  • Posts: 133
    • View Profile
Re: help newbe warning!!
« Reply #5 on: March 07, 2008, 08:43:14 pm »
Quote
Not really the point, guys - but if you have the exact hardware/screen/etc that is used in the video, it will work right out of the box! It does actually say that in the caveats on-screen and verbally, and on the web site I believe. But of course, who has that exact hardware? We just ignore that bit and assume that it isn't as specific as that.... it is, but as long as you aren't trying to re-engineer how the system works, generally it is pretty easy to get going. If you read back through the volumous threads that talk about these issues in the past, you will find that almost all of them are either using a video card that wasn't supported my LMCE or trying to unwind the dual-NIC/DHCP/etc parts of LMCE. You'll also find plenty of people saying that once they accepted the structure it all went easy Smiley

Use one of the listed video cards (definitely nVidia), a screen that has a wide range of scan frequencies (not just HD!), and wire it up with the as-designed network configuration before you start building, and it will work like a dream Wink

collinjones,  man I seriously have to disagree with your assessment  If it is clearly stated that very specific hardware was used to to create that video and to make "out of the box" claims... why have so many people missed that part?  I'm not saying it's not there, actually went and checked to be sure. your right, but it's not very obvious.  for example, when I first undertook this venture, I was in the same boat as gazzzman, I saw the video, thought it was cool... actually asked the question (what kind of hardware) did some quick searching and read the guys commentary, I then bought an nvido 6200 as stated inthe wiki works perfectly... I also bought a pvr 150mce tuner, again stated it works perfectly.  Those are the two main items I needed, I had everything else.  Motherboard/cpu/mem/case etc...  and I had nothing but problems, and it wasn't specifically the hardware... first I couldn't get network shares working, come to find out there is a different process in which the wizard detects your shares between UI1 and the UI2/3 modes.  This is has not been confirmed by other users, but I have been able to re-create this over and over...  also found out it doesn't like passwords containing !@#$%^&*() chars... took me a week just to get network shares mounting correctly.. then mythtv was freezing.   but wait!!! I have EXACTLY all hardware that is claimed to work, everything I purchased was off the wiki "already tested and compatible" list... so it took me about 3 weeks to get that working, was an error in the code...  now i'm trying to remove the statically set interlacing and codec options for mythtv that are hardcoded into the source, so if one wants to change his interlace settings, guess what, next time you reboot or mythtv plugin gets reloaded, your right back to mythtv setting the original programmer deemed everyone should use muwahahah... anyways..  so i'm still struggling with that... I see helluvha mantis tickets all dealing with software issues "out of the box" not hardware issues...

I'm not saying what your stating is not true, and I have read alot of threads so far, and what I really see is alot of denial from the technical community, trying to blame it on not having the right hardware... and 50% of the time they are right, but the 50% of the posts they are just in denial and trying to blame it on something other than a sofware problem...

for example, my posts about windows shares, the first 10 or so posts were people telling me different hardware setups to try, telling me "oh it's your network setup... do this do that... switch cards, put ext on this put int on this, blah blah" but in the long run it had absolutely nothing to do with my hardware. 

Exhibit A:
http://forum.linuxmce.org/index.php?topic=4260.0

Then there was my mythtv problem I mentioned
Exhibit B:
http://forum.linuxmce.org/index.php?topic=4029.0

Then there are these people who have the correct hardware but still no "out of the box" go go there either...
when I searched the word "video" on this forum, the first page is 75% software issues...


Besides.. I click on the video link and read that entire article again at http://wiki.linuxmce.org/index.php/Screenshots the only mention of hardware I saw, was the metnion that any video card capable of OpenGL can run UI2 and UI3.... the only mention of specific hardware here is
Quote
which currently is only the nVidia 6xxx and greater.
which tells us nothing except cards 6000 model and up should work... which we know not to be true, i've seen several people with 8800 cards not working properly, I have an 8600 that just will NOT work no matter what... and my 6800 does not display video out the VGA port during the inital AVWizard, I have to do everything blindly.

The actual mention of any specific hardware in the video happens within the first 15 seconds, a bubble window pops up for 3 seconds just saying
Quote
get this video in hi-def plus technical details, known bugs, hardware list: http://wiki.linuxmce.com/index.php/Video
and this is while the narrator is speaking about booting off the cd.

Even reading the link provided in the video, mentions absolutely nothing about needing very specific hardware for this to work except int he begining when he typed
Quote
Not much. So far most users have reported it works as expected on the first try so long as the video card is compatible.
And then he's just talking about the video card, not other equipment.

The only thing mentioned there is the hardware he used in the video, nothing about loosing the out of the box experience if one decideds to use different but equivalent hardware.

You are right about one thing, the innate nature of us to "ignore" whats right in front of us... well like I have tried to demonstrate, they may have put it "right in front of our eyes", but it's not clear by no means about the specific hardware deal.  When I first watched the video, I read his ENTIRE commentary, and I was honestly convinced that equivelant hardware will work because there was no mention about specific hardware being required, just what the hardware need to be capable of.

Now, all this analyzing is all pointless anyway, it's free software so who cares right?

gazzzman,
Quote
though TBH I don't know if I would be better getting a hauppage 150 analog capture card and using it with mythtv and my dreambox instead Smiley
I used the 150MCE, and it works very well... I do not have a single complaint, the picture is very clear and responsive (after setting your interlacing and codec options in mythfrontend manually since some coder decided EVERYONE shoud be bob method interlacing with the xv codec and opengl vsync turned off)

I do need to advise you, I ended up re-installing from the quick install dvd probably 50 times in one week.  It was from all the troubleshooting, i'm a very aggressive troubleshooter, so I ended up breaking my installation 3 or 4 times a day.  So be prepared to break your install and re-install several times before getting everything working properly.
entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem

colinjones

  • Alumni
  • LinuxMCE God
  • *
  • Posts: 3003
    • View Profile
Re: help newbe warning!!
« Reply #6 on: March 08, 2008, 01:25:17 am »
wow - that post is huge, sorry I'm literally out the door so haven't read it all. Just one response to the first bit. I never said "clearly"! You said that :) I was not claiming it was clear at all! It definitely isn't!

orionsune

  • Veteran
  • ***
  • Posts: 133
    • View Profile
Re: help newbe warning!!
« Reply #7 on: March 08, 2008, 01:34:44 am »
Yeah I know you didn't say clearly... but everyone keeps making it sound like it's obvious or something.  I only analyzed the situation based on my own personal experiences and opinions sooooo....  I'm just agreeing it's not CLEAR.... with why...
entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem

gazzzman

  • Veteran
  • ***
  • Posts: 118
    • View Profile
Re: help newbe warning!!
« Reply #8 on: March 08, 2008, 01:00:49 pm »
hi all and thanks for the help and encouragement :)
I have to be honest here :) I just saw the video and rushed off and started playing :)
you know how it is sometimes when you see a tasty new project!
anyhow..
I have scrapped the usb dtv tuners for the moment (I think I will ad them to my MD's when VDR gets fully sorted) and I have found a mce150 that seems to work :)
I admit I have not got the xml grabber to work yet (there are 2 uk sources listed as default the bbc radiotimes source just goes up to 50% and stays there forever the other immediatly exits :)  )
but hey! at least I have tv!
nobody has really mentioned the cm15!
will I get it to work?
(without to much "hacking" something I know virtually NOTHING about)
and will a windows mce remote (the IR bit) operate my av gear?
or do I need to chase arround after a gc-100 (they seem to be pretty rare here as well as expensive)
lastly (for now)
I notice in the "capture card options" a dbox2 listed (via IP) does that mean there is a likelyhood of being able to use my dream box via the network as a capture device and will I be able to controll it that way?
sorry for so many questions :)
this project is a heady mix of excitement and utter frustration lol!!
thanks again for all your hellp guys (and any galls if there are any here :)  )
I see my box keeps saying it is unable to get ivtv drivers.. but I think I saw something about this in known issues :)
cheers
Gazzman
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version 3.1
GCC@GE@GIT@GO dpu S-: a+ C+++ L++ E-- W+++ N+ o+++ w-- O M+ PS+++ PE-- Y++
PGP+ t++ 5 X++ R- tv b+ DI++ D---- G e++* h*++ r+++ Y++++
-----END GEEK CODE BLOCK-----

totallymaxed

  • LinuxMCE God
  • ****
  • Posts: 4351
    • View Profile
    • Dianemo - at home with technology
Re: help newbe warning!!
« Reply #9 on: March 08, 2008, 02:57:58 pm »
Quote
Not really the point, guys - but if you have the exact hardware/screen/etc that is used in the video, it will work right out of the box! It does actually say that in the caveats on-screen and verbally, and on the web site I believe. But of course, who has that exact hardware? We just ignore that bit and assume that it isn't as specific as that.... it is, but as long as you aren't trying to re-engineer how the system works, generally it is pretty easy to get going. If you read back through the volumous threads that talk about these issues in the past, you will find that almost all of them are either using a video card that wasn't supported my LMCE or trying to unwind the dual-NIC/DHCP/etc parts of LMCE. You'll also find plenty of people saying that once they accepted the structure it all went easy Smiley

Use one of the listed video cards (definitely nVidia), a screen that has a wide range of scan frequencies (not just HD!), and wire it up with the as-designed network configuration before you start building, and it will work like a dream Wink

collinjones,  man I seriously have to disagree with your assessment  If it is clearly stated that very specific hardware was used to to create that video and to make "out of the box" claims... why have so many people missed that part?  I'm not saying it's not there, actually went and checked to be sure. your right, but it's not very obvious.  for example, when I first undertook this venture, I was in the same boat as gazzzman, I saw the video, thought it was cool... actually asked the question (what kind of hardware) did some quick searching and read the guys commentary, I then bought an nvido 6200 as stated inthe wiki works perfectly... I also bought a pvr 150mce tuner, again stated it works perfectly.  Those are the two main items I needed, I had everything else.  Motherboard/cpu/mem/case etc...  and I had nothing but problems, and it wasn't specifically the hardware... first I couldn't get network shares working, come to find out there is a different process in which the wizard detects your shares between UI1 and the UI2/3 modes.  This is has not been confirmed by other users, but I have been able to re-create this over and over...  also found out it doesn't like passwords containing !@#$%^&*() chars... took me a week just to get network shares mounting correctly.. then mythtv was freezing.   but wait!!! I have EXACTLY all hardware that is claimed to work, everything I purchased was off the wiki "already tested and compatible" list... so it took me about 3 weeks to get that working, was an error in the code...  now i'm trying to remove the statically set interlacing and codec options for mythtv that are hardcoded into the source, so if one wants to change his interlace settings, guess what, next time you reboot or mythtv plugin gets reloaded, your right back to mythtv setting the original programmer deemed everyone should use muwahahah... anyways..  so i'm still struggling with that... I see helluvha mantis tickets all dealing with software issues "out of the box" not hardware issues...

I'm not saying what your stating is not true, and I have read alot of threads so far, and what I really see is alot of denial from the technical community, trying to blame it on not having the right hardware... and 50% of the time they are right, but the 50% of the posts they are just in denial and trying to blame it on something other than a sofware problem...

for example, my posts about windows shares, the first 10 or so posts were people telling me different hardware setups to try, telling me "oh it's your network setup... do this do that... switch cards, put ext on this put int on this, blah blah" but in the long run it had absolutely nothing to do with my hardware. 

Exhibit A:
http://forum.linuxmce.org/index.php?topic=4260.0

Then there was my mythtv problem I mentioned
Exhibit B:
http://forum.linuxmce.org/index.php?topic=4029.0

Then there are these people who have the correct hardware but still no "out of the box" go go there either...
when I searched the word "video" on this forum, the first page is 75% software issues...


Besides.. I click on the video link and read that entire article again at http://wiki.linuxmce.org/index.php/Screenshots the only mention of hardware I saw, was the metnion that any video card capable of OpenGL can run UI2 and UI3.... the only mention of specific hardware here is
Quote
which currently is only the nVidia 6xxx and greater.
which tells us nothing except cards 6000 model and up should work... which we know not to be true, i've seen several people with 8800 cards not working properly, I have an 8600 that just will NOT work no matter what... and my 6800 does not display video out the VGA port during the inital AVWizard, I have to do everything blindly.

The actual mention of any specific hardware in the video happens within the first 15 seconds, a bubble window pops up for 3 seconds just saying
Quote
get this video in hi-def plus technical details, known bugs, hardware list: http://wiki.linuxmce.com/index.php/Video
and this is while the narrator is speaking about booting off the cd.

Even reading the link provided in the video, mentions absolutely nothing about needing very specific hardware for this to work except int he begining when he typed
Quote
Not much. So far most users have reported it works as expected on the first try so long as the video card is compatible.
And then he's just talking about the video card, not other equipment.

The only thing mentioned there is the hardware he used in the video, nothing about loosing the out of the box experience if one decideds to use different but equivalent hardware.

You are right about one thing, the innate nature of us to "ignore" whats right in front of us... well like I have tried to demonstrate, they may have put it "right in front of our eyes", but it's not clear by no means about the specific hardware deal.  When I first watched the video, I read his ENTIRE commentary, and I was honestly convinced that equivelant hardware will work because there was no mention about specific hardware being required, just what the hardware need to be capable of.

Now, all this analyzing is all pointless anyway, it's free software so who cares right?

gazzzman,
Quote
though TBH I don't know if I would be better getting a hauppage 150 analog capture card and using it with mythtv and my dreambox instead Smiley
I used the 150MCE, and it works very well... I do not have a single complaint, the picture is very clear and responsive (after setting your interlacing and codec options in mythfrontend manually since some coder decided EVERYONE shoud be bob method interlacing with the xv codec and opengl vsync turned off)

I do need to advise you, I ended up re-installing from the quick install dvd probably 50 times in one week.  It was from all the troubleshooting, i'm a very aggressive troubleshooter, so I ended up breaking my installation 3 or 4 times a day.  So be prepared to break your install and re-install several times before getting everything working properly.

... and the other factor of course is that the video was shot back in late July 2007... ie 7-8 months ago now. LinuxMCE even 6 weeks after the video was put together had changed massively in may areas internally... and now that is even more the case.

The fact is the vast majority of people manage to get a basic install working in a reasonable amount of time (a few hours). But ther are always some that don't manage that for many different reasons. Their is no getting away from the basic fact that LinuxMCE is an incredibly complex and very larger software project that encompasses many large projects (ie MythTV, Asterisk etc etc to name just a few). Any of the component projects that are contained within LinuxMCE are on their own (ie if you installed them independently of LinuxMCE) major undertakings to install/configure and get working. The fact that LinuxMCE 'wraps' all of these projects up and manages so much for you is always going to through up some issues... so please be understanding of that.

Overall i think we have a group of incredibly enthusiastic people here who for the most part go well beyond "the call of duty" to help anyone who needs it in this forum... and they do that mostly in there spare time. I and a few others here do this stuff for a living but we still give our time here for free because helping someone here helps us figure things out for our paying customers too. Its a virtuous circle that works for all concerned.

So when things don't work as expected its not because someone decided to deliberately ruin your day ;-)
Andy Herron,
Convergent Home Technologies Ltd
United Kingdom
@herron

Dianemo S Now Shipping on Ubuntu 12.04LTS
Build your system on the latest Ubuntu LTS OS Release!

Get a Dianemo S License: http://forum.linuxmce.org/index.php?topic=8880.0
iOS Orbiter: http://wiki.linuxmce.org/index.php/Dianemo_iOS_Orbiter
Follow us on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/pages/Dianemo-Home-Automation/226019387454465

Sales & Info:
http://www.dianemo.co.uk

gazzzman

  • Veteran
  • ***
  • Posts: 118
    • View Profile
Re: help newbe warning!!
« Reply #10 on: March 14, 2008, 12:07:59 am »
hi all!
just a word of thanks!
I am still getting my head round the software and hardware issues (a lot of them probably caused by me)
totallymaxed I think you nailed it with your appraisal on the fact that all of the individual projects are massive!
asterix alone is a beast to learn especially if you are not familiar with the concepts it encompasses!
the problem (I think) is a lot of people watch the video.. never having even seen Linux before
they are used to windows and the fact the hardware compatibility is greater
and get one hell of a culture shock!
I think there is not enough emphasis placed on how critical the hardware is to the out of box experience :)
and what you are getting yourself into if you stray to far!
one last point..
the "out of the box" thing (at the moment) seems unlikely to work outside of the US
and I don't think think the "average european" has got their head round that yet :)
as to the community.. and developers..
I think they all do an ASTOUNDING job!
you all go out of your way to help and make people feel welcome!
and LinuxMCE itself is astounding!
I just wish there where a few more UK developers to ad some UK specific stuff!
as a relative newbe to Linux.. I am at times finding some of the things I am having to do (and some decisions too) hard going!
but the expierence is greatly rewarding when you finally get things right!
I still have a long way to go..
and an awfull lot to learn!
some people seem to learn Linux instinctivly I have been using M$ since dos 3.2
I am finding some concepts "difficult" or "challenging" lol!
god alone knows how the developers and others ever learned enough to actually program!
I am just beggining to understand shell scripts (a tiny bit)
so guys and galls all I can say is a sincere "thank you" for all the work you all do and all those sleepless nights!
 I will continue to try and learn..
and to try and get others to try Linux in general!
thats the best I can do in return for the endless work of all the people who make these projects a reality :)
thanks..
Gazzzman
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version 3.1
GCC@GE@GIT@GO dpu S-: a+ C+++ L++ E-- W+++ N+ o+++ w-- O M+ PS+++ PE-- Y++
PGP+ t++ 5 X++ R- tv b+ DI++ D---- G e++* h*++ r+++ Y++++
-----END GEEK CODE BLOCK-----

orionsune

  • Veteran
  • ***
  • Posts: 133
    • View Profile
Re: help newbe warning!!
« Reply #11 on: March 14, 2008, 08:19:58 pm »
You are absolutey right Totallymaxed, I neglected to include that tidbit in my original analysis, about the age of the video, and yes MOST people not trying to do anything more than a frontend for their download movies, do have successful installs.  I mean, my first install was EXACTLY out of the box.  But also my first install was on a basic system with no TV Tuner card, no security cameras, no web orbiters, no digital sound... none of the exotic stuff that makes a home theatre worth the trouble.


But like I said, and gazz too, it's extremely rewarding, I would do it again if I had to... Oh wait, I do, once a week, when my installation breaks for some unknown obscure reason, most likely something i've done...
entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem

tschak909

  • LinuxMCE God
  • ****
  • Posts: 5476
  • DOES work for LinuxMCE.
    • View Profile
Re: help newbe warning!!
« Reply #12 on: March 15, 2008, 05:21:13 am »
I would like to point out, that I am one of many people, who have a house wide system, with multiple media directors, multiple orbiter types (I have one of each, including a cisco 7970 phone), and Z-Wave, and GC-100 for home automation. The system works.

-Thom

totallymaxed

  • LinuxMCE God
  • ****
  • Posts: 4351
    • View Profile
    • Dianemo - at home with technology
Re: help newbe warning!!
« Reply #13 on: March 15, 2008, 11:02:44 am »
hi all!
just a word of thanks!
I am still getting my head round the software and hardware issues (a lot of them probably caused by me)
totallymaxed I think you nailed it with your appraisal on the fact that all of the individual projects are massive!
asterix alone is a beast to learn especially if you are not familiar with the concepts it encompasses!
the problem (I think) is a lot of people watch the video.. never having even seen Linux before
they are used to windows and the fact the hardware compatibility is greater
and get one hell of a culture shock!
I think there is not enough emphasis placed on how critical the hardware is to the out of box experience :)
and what you are getting yourself into if you stray to far!
one last point..
the "out of the box" thing (at the moment) seems unlikely to work outside of the US
and I don't think think the "average european" has got their head round that yet :)
as to the community.. and developers..
I think they all do an ASTOUNDING job!
you all go out of your way to help and make people feel welcome!
and LinuxMCE itself is astounding!
I just wish there where a few more UK developers to ad some UK specific stuff!
as a relative newbe to Linux.. I am at times finding some of the things I am having to do (and some decisions too) hard going!
but the expierence is greatly rewarding when you finally get things right!
I still have a long way to go..
and an awfull lot to learn!
some people seem to learn Linux instinctivly I have been using M$ since dos 3.2
I am finding some concepts "difficult" or "challenging" lol!
god alone knows how the developers and others ever learned enough to actually program!
I am just beggining to understand shell scripts (a tiny bit)
so guys and galls all I can say is a sincere "thank you" for all the work you all do and all those sleepless nights!
 I will continue to try and learn..
and to try and get others to try Linux in general!
thats the best I can do in return for the endless work of all the people who make these projects a reality :)
thanks..
Gazzzman

Hi Gazzzman,

I dont think whether your in the US or not is too much of a factor in reality... and I would like to point out that there is an increasingly strong European contingent in the LinuxMCE community and on the Forum. Of course we are also based in the UK and have been working with Pluto (LinuxMCE's pre-cursor) from the very beginning and have been involved with LinuxMCE from its conception too.

All the best

Andrew
Andy Herron,
Convergent Home Technologies Ltd
United Kingdom
@herron

Dianemo S Now Shipping on Ubuntu 12.04LTS
Build your system on the latest Ubuntu LTS OS Release!

Get a Dianemo S License: http://forum.linuxmce.org/index.php?topic=8880.0
iOS Orbiter: http://wiki.linuxmce.org/index.php/Dianemo_iOS_Orbiter
Follow us on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/pages/Dianemo-Home-Automation/226019387454465

Sales & Info:
http://www.dianemo.co.uk

gazzzman

  • Veteran
  • ***
  • Posts: 118
    • View Profile
Re: help newbe warning!!
« Reply #14 on: March 15, 2008, 12:41:17 pm »
hi Andrew!
in a lot of ways it makes an huge difference
mainly cost and availibility!
for example zwave stuff is really quite hard to source in the UK and when you do find it.. you can expect to pay between 2 and 3 times the price!
the same goes for X10 :(
the GC-100 is not exactly "off the shelf" here either!
sure the PC stuff is available accross the board..
and I am sure if you have plenty of money (you would then be getting someone else to do the work anyway)
anything is possible :)
but even "doing it on the cheap" in the UK is going to cost a small fortune!
"a zwave lighting system for about $60 fro home depot"
well just the zwave PC interface is going excess of $130 in the UK!
and that is without any modules!
so we tend to use "what we have" a lot more here! sadly "what we have" is rarely if ever exactly what we need :)
I for one have spent ages converting 110V X10 stuff to 240V
and some things just DON'T convert :)
them "socket rocket" light fittings are the ultimate in fiddly lol!
most of the preconfiguration is done for US services and providers..
it is just more work and less chance it will work "out of the box" here!
Andrew.. with you working on it regularly you become accustomed to the quirks untill you no longer see them!
(like I can set up a Seleco CRT video projector in 20 Mins and I know all their quirks so I no longer even notice them!)
none of this of course a detrement to Linuxmce merely pointing out that the average user in the UK is going to have a "different" out of the box "expierence" than the average US user!
Just my 2p!
(mind.. it would help if I could even get my core fully functional at the moment lol!!)
have a great weekend everybody!
and thanks to everyone that has helped me so far :)
Gazzzman
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version 3.1
GCC@GE@GIT@GO dpu S-: a+ C+++ L++ E-- W+++ N+ o+++ w-- O M+ PS+++ PE-- Y++
PGP+ t++ 5 X++ R- tv b+ DI++ D---- G e++* h*++ r+++ Y++++
-----END GEEK CODE BLOCK-----