Author Topic: would you pay 150$ in a pice of remote control  (Read 5944 times)

lightsoul

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would you pay 150$ in a pice of remote control
« on: September 02, 2007, 10:03:47 am »
i don't think its good idea to spend FiireChief 150$ in one remote control, since the remote always unsafe from children and from adult sometimes. i always change each remote in my home with new one, bottom line is that the remote life is not that long unless you are alone or you have very hairy carpet  ;D.
also to spend 500$ in FiireStation is not wroth it since its china made and with 500$ you can complete system not "diskless station", i believe the price here will limit the growth of linuxMCE and Fiire product. Windows MCE remote will cost about 35$

i love LinuxMCE but that will not made me out of mind to go and buy such hardware, now im having problem with remote and i only have ATI RF remote and twinhan remote control which left unused in my home.

i wish that LinuxMce be more open for other Hardware and interface to give us the chance to buy with good options.

thanks

PeteK

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Re: would you pay 150$ in a pice of remote control
« Reply #1 on: September 02, 2007, 07:26:23 pm »
Actually, LinuxMCE is an open source piece of software, which means it's free to distribute and you can load it on any hardware platform you want (that meets a minimum set of requirements).  So you are not locked into the fiire hardware by any means.  It also supports a wide range of remotes (including the Windows MCE remote), so you can use that if you don't want to pay for the features of the Fiire remote.

You can download LinuxMCE here:

http://wiki.linuxmce.org/index.php/Download

1audio

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Re: would you pay 150$ in a pice of remote control
« Reply #2 on: September 02, 2007, 08:08:55 pm »
We all have different perspectives and values that we bring to this. You may find the prices high comparing them to the cheapest possible hardware that meets the specs (and what computer hardware isn't made in China today? IBM Blue Gene's?)

However some consumers spend more on a wireless tablet control than the complete Fiire system costs (A Crestron tablet can cost over $5000). And there are few comparable systems with LMCE's capability, let alone affordable ones. Fiires efforts to make and sell a product should be lauded, especially with such small margins for such a low volume product. If you look at premium universal remotes they start at over $100 and lack some key features of the Fiire remote like RF connection (don't need to point at the receiver) the gyro of course etc. And the MCE version of the Gyro sells for $150 at Fry's, an aggressive discounter on computer stuff, so its pretty reasonable I think.

A common misunderstanding is that an old or underpowered computer can be reused as a video system. Video is one of the most intensive tasks a computer can do today, especially if the video quality is good. Cheap computers won't meet the necessary requirements. LinuxMCE is free but the time spent making it work has value to most people. Making it work on hardware that won't work can be very expensive time. If Fiire makes $100 pulling the right components together that work and stands behind the effort I think its the bargain of a lifetime. Most CE companies today expect a net margin of 30-50% and the retailers demand more except for money losing products like TV's. A gross margin of under 20% (my guess) for Fiire must be an introductory price because its just too cheap.

Finding a complete computer with the power to play HD video well and use little power making little noise is very difficult. I tried a Dell that should have met the requirements but 1) the box was huge, 2) it only had VGA output for some reason, 3) it was noisy and its all downhill from there. Not to mention Linux driver hassles.

If someone else can get into this selling systems for less I would be surprised.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2007, 08:16:54 pm by 1audio »

dopey

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Re: would you pay 150$ in a pice of remote control
« Reply #3 on: September 03, 2007, 02:32:18 am »
Wow... 1audio, you wrote almost exactly what I was thinking as I read the first post...

lightsoul

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Re: would you pay 150$ in a pice of remote control
« Reply #4 on: September 03, 2007, 10:48:19 am »
So you think that it worth to spend 150$ in that remote control, this will be the most expansive remote I’v ever seen. My thought, I would rather spend 40$ to buy the linuxmce software than to buy very specific hardware.  If I buy the software or to buy support for that software will not limit the delivery since it’s over internet while the hardware is kind of fragile and when I break it I will not be able to get another since its coming from overseas and will cost me 150+30 shipping=180. I know its brand new hardware and you will never find it in local market and when and I don’t want to get other remote which is limited function or has some work around to get it working, if I want to buy I will buy the right and full function. I don’t have that much of time to read and test all the way to get the system work although I’m not programmer to get advantage of open source I’m only consumer who want that with reasonable price. One factor for popularity is the cost.
My opinion if I were in their shoes as follows,
Linuxmce = free
Support=  25$ per year
Remote control = 35$
Plugins and extra features= 25 a year or 45$+support
Package= RM+ support+ extra features = 65
Linuxmce is not comparable to other, actually there is no such software in the world doing the same functions, therefore I assure that it will gain lots of millions from the world since people look for (affordable+ cost-effective+ scalable+ easy of use and setup+ reachable)
I know there is some buyer for that remote 150$
Its better to get 1millions  to spend 45$ than to be closed for 1000 buyer which they spend 500$
1000 buyer the company earn 500,000$
The first plan 45,000,000
So if I were the company I will make it under the first plan somehow.
Anyway you are not talking to U.S or UK you are talking to the whole world, as of me Im from Saudi Arabia “sorry for my bad English”  and LinuxMCE took my attention and wishing to get it work at my home. Im not poor to say im not able to buy that whole system but its like that, im not going to spend money for something extra in my life even its unique unless its reasonable compare to  what we have in the world.
I was going to use windowsMCE or Tvedia but I didn’t find what I’m looking for, so I found it in LMCE and I will wait till they upgrade to version which can use any low price or reachable device.
Sorry to make you read all that but really I wrote it because I wish for better. I respect your opinion and I’m sure not all of you will agree with what I said, since everyone has its own reason regardless whom affiliated to LMCE or fiire company.
Don’t also forget that LMCE is not portable so next year we will see amazing portable media center that can do all that with more feature and will said I wish I didn’t spend that much so I can buy this too.

Thank you gentlemen for reading bad English.

dopey

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Re: would you pay 150$ in a pice of remote control
« Reply #5 on: September 03, 2007, 11:42:56 am »
Actually that remote is priced based on the market. As previously mentioned comparable remotes are the same price or more expensive. Of course you can use a remote that is cheaper, but it will have fewer features, such as follow me.

The idea of LinuxMCE is you can build a budget system for relatively cheap, or you can go all out and spend literally $100's of thousands of dollars on a state-of-the-art system. Of course the more money you spend, the more features you get.

With LinuxMCE, in order to get many new features you need new hardware, because older and cheaper hardware simply doesn't have the capabilites the new custom stuff does.

I do expect the WinMCE Gyration remote to go down in price in 1-3 years and the Fiire remote will follow. By then they would likley have a new version of the remote that is just as expensive though. This will not happen, however, until the rule of supply and demand says they will make more in doing so. Your argument that they will make more money if they sell it for cheaper is flawed as they have several analysts in the industry whose sole purpose is find the G-spot in price based on supply and demand...

BTW, $150 is in no way the most expensive remote I've seen. Harmony remotes sell for between $80-$400, depending on the model. They sell for that much because people can afford and they buy it. Those who can't afford it get their cheaper model, so they cover both bases. It's business 101...

cirion

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Re: would you pay 150$ in a pice of remote control
« Reply #6 on: September 04, 2007, 10:02:39 am »
I'd happily  spend 150$ on a good remote. I actually find it cheap... Most crappy remotes cost round 150$ here in Norway... The good ones cost a fortune...

I have a Marantz RC5000i wich I payed 665$ for and a Philips RC9800i that cost 835$ and yet because of LinuxMCE the FireChief seems to do a lot more than those two remotes.... I do prefer the design of the Philips RC9800i but it's not really programmable like the Pronto remotes and does not work well with LinuxMCE since it wants to do the stuff that LinuxMCE does...

Hagen

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Re: would you pay 150$ in a pice of remote control
« Reply #7 on: September 04, 2007, 10:54:43 am »
Wonder if avforum.no would set up a mass purchase of fiire engines, stations and chiefs...

Todd

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Re: would you pay 150$ in a pice of remote control
« Reply #8 on: September 04, 2007, 09:45:24 pm »
I believe lightsoul has confused linuxmce as being one and the same as fiire.  They are two different entities.  Fiire is a company that makes products to use linuxmce.  Linuxmce is the one making this great FREE software.  I think it is great that a business is catering to open source software.

Yes $150.00 for a remote makes me stop and catch my breath.  That is an expensive remote.  Fortunately we don't have to use it.  Having said that, there are several high end remotes that cost more.

Again, we don't have to buy Fiire's computers.  We can build, or buy our own that will work.  Although I have not tested one, according to their website specs Fiire does add value by making small, thin, energy efficient, quite computers to act as media directors.  If a person does not see value in those features, they are still free to build their own computer.

I like having Fiire's options available.  They may not be for everyone, but some people will benefit from what they are doing.

boudicca

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Re: would you pay 150$ in a pice of remote control
« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2007, 10:21:53 pm »

A common misunderstanding is that an old or underpowered computer can be reused as a video system. Video is one of the most intensive tasks a computer can do today, especially if the video quality is good.


I beg to differ. It takes a lot of processing to encode or reencode on the fly, not to decode.

The issue for MCE's is not the hardware....otherwise you wouldn't be able to pickup a dvd player for £30 at your local store or buy a digital hard disk video recorder for around £80.

Or even a Network Media Player for <£150.....and shows 1080i divx, TS streams too.

Now if you want to record at HD.....now that requires hardware......but even then.....Sigma Designs SMP8634.....can...other chips can......HD Sat and Cable Cards can without even bothering the processor.

Its all relative......

Cheers

Shaz

PS On the original topic, I agree....custom remotes expensive....

MediaMonkey

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Re: would you pay 150$ in a pice of remote control
« Reply #10 on: September 05, 2007, 03:04:09 am »
also to spend 500$ in FiireStation is not wroth it since its china made and with 500$ you can complete system not "diskless station", i believe the price here will limit the growth of linuxMCE and Fiire product.

A common misunderstanding is that an old or underpowered computer can be reused as a video system. Video is one of the most intensive tasks a computer can do today, especially if the video quality is good. Cheap computers won't meet the necessary requirements.

As far as I can tell from the pictures, Fiire media directors are Via EPIA EX Mini ITX systems with Via's own C7 Processors 1.0 to 1.5GHz. Only advantage of it over an equally clocked Intel or AMD cpu is its native MPEG decoding ability and lower power consumption.

I don't think Fiire went ahead and custom built the motherboard chipset or CPU or even the motherboard for their media directors (at least for the desktop version). That could happen in the future, but you will certainly have other alternatives.

However some consumers spend more on a wireless tablet control than the complete Fiire system costs (A Crestron tablet can cost over $5000). And there

The fact that there are products selling for over $5000 does not make Media centers worth that much. Using computers for sharing media does not involve any new technology per-se. It is more or less like sharing software on any other diskless client/server like LTSP. If you want to play only music then all you need is a bunch of LTSP terminals connected to a Linux Server.

You cannot compare that with say Plasma TVs 10 years ago which used to sell for 10's of thousands of US Dollars. Companies could demand that kind of money because of the new technology (and hardware) involved.

In case of media sharing business, companies can make money even in the future with "mostly" Open source software because of DRM. I heard that the DRM enabled decoder cards will be available only to OEM manufactures meeting their licensing requirements such as keeping the system as black box. Open source software and hobbyist hardwares will be limited to use non-DRM stuff, so they will never become competitions for these companies.

« Last Edit: September 05, 2007, 03:12:28 am by MediaMonkey »
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countzer0

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Re: would you pay 150$ in a pice of remote control
« Reply #11 on: September 05, 2007, 03:15:42 am »
But to find out that alot of the cool features from the video are only available on a $150 remote i think is the surprise for most.

IMHO

If a bit of time was spent with the wii remote, or the gyration, we could make these work out of the box as well.  Perhaps we should focus more on the Nokia770 as the "cool" remote as it has now droped in price less then the Fiire Chief.

teedge77

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Re: would you pay 150$ in a pice of remote control
« Reply #12 on: September 05, 2007, 03:31:11 am »
150 for a remote that has the functionality of the fiire remote is not extreme.
check out some of these and then tell me 150 for the fiire remote is too much.
none of these, that i saw, had gyration.
none of them have a follow me option for linuxmce.
not all of them have wireless capability and most are infrared only.
none of them have cool misspellings like "FIIRE" for their name  ;D

http://www.circuitcity.com/ccd/productDetail.do?oid=155138&WT.mc_n=6&WT.mc_t=U&cm_ven=COMPARISON%20SHOPPING&cm_cat=YAHOO&cm_pla=DATAFEED->PRODUCTS&cm_ite=1%20PRODUCT&cm_keycode=6

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000BVIV0O/ref=nosim/?tag=yahoo-ce-20&creative=380333&creativeASIN=B000BVIV0O&linkCode=asn

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000UTO1CY/ref=nosim?s=merchant&m=A2EBKGKF3J2YXR&v=glance&tag=yahoo-ce-mp-20&creative=380341&linkCode=asn&creativeASIN=B000UTO1CY

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-8L0oRc29PyY/cgi-bin/prodview.asp?i=596AUR890

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16880111001&ATT=80-111-001&CMP=OTC-yah00TT&cm_mmc=OTC-yah00TT-_-Digital+Media+Remote-_-Logitech+Inc.-_-80111001

http://shopping.yahoo.com/p:Philips%20TSU7500%20Remote%20Control:1993339137:page=compare;_ylt=AhGd8tWNkkO83_HiEQZNTpnKB8wE;_ylu=X3oDMTA2bTQ0OXZjBHNlYwNzcg--

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=2475107&Sku=P109-1126&SRCCODE=YAHOODF&CMP=SPC-YAHOO

http://www.onecall.com/ProductDetails.aspx?id=34577

http://www.thenerds.net/PHILIPS.RC9800i_Remote.RC9800I.html?affid=1&affid=9&srccode=cii_1038957&cpncode=08-30885387-2

http://www.6ave.com/shop/product.aspx?ref=yahoo&sku=URCMX850
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boudicca

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Re: would you pay 150$ in a pice of remote control
« Reply #13 on: September 05, 2007, 11:09:18 pm »
>none of these, that i saw, had gyration.
>none of them have a follow me option for linuxmce.
>not all of them have wireless capability and most are infrared only.
>none of them have cool misspellings like "FIIRE" for their name  ;D

You didn't look hard enough....

newbielink:http://www.woolworths.co.uk/web/jsp/product/index.jsp?pid=50785645 [nonactive]
newbielink:http://www.tesco.com/entertainment/product.aspx?R=751840&bci=4%7CGames [nonactive]*4294207740%7CNINTENDO%20WII%20HARDWARE
newbielink:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_ytdW6Ys2A [nonactive]
newbielink:http://onakasuita.org/wii/index-e.html [nonactive]

Ok...they don't have follow me but frankly don't care about that....and its cooler to
spell ffire as phyre or fyre Phire would have sufficed. Ffire sounds like you got a speech problem.


;)


teedge77

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Re: would you pay 150$ in a pice of remote control
« Reply #14 on: September 05, 2007, 11:24:58 pm »
ummmmm....somewhere you missed the point.....150 isnt a horrible price....its not even outrageous....its actually pretty reasonable comparatively. the wii remote is 30 bucks for a reason.....can you start and stop anything without seeing it on screen(maybe)? youd be limited to the few buttons it has being assigned. set macros (maybe)? again youd be limited to the few buttons. have two way communication? anyway....get your wii remote....and have fun....150 isnt that bad....


and its not spelled "FFIRE" its spelled "FIIRE" no speech impediment there. just long drawn out annoyance if you actually pronounce it that way.
« Last Edit: September 05, 2007, 11:57:53 pm by teedge77 »
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