Possy, what control do you use with them, RS232?

I think what Thom says is probably the truth but I fear what I will find price-wise in that regard. I may be wrong but if it's a case of tripling or quadrupling my budget for a receiver then it may be out of my pricing zone as techstyle hints. Sadly, I guess, the guys that play in the custom install market know that their customers do not have a budget problem.

Regarding CEC - I guess what I was saying ito poor support is that firstly graphics cards with HDMI outputs don't support it which is annoying. Unless it's way more complex than I realise, that would be a big step forward and we wouldn't have to worry about injectors. Then, secondly, I understand that the manufacturers typically have their own set of protocols and codes Bravia Sync etc etc with limited overlap. I gather if you have an HDMI port on your device you're obliged to wire it for CEC but not implement it unless you want to.

How about an Arduino injector? Would that be an option? Don't know much about Pi and Duinos except that Duinos are a bit cheaper and more accessible in my neck of the woods.

Anyway, it will be fun to see my local AV "Experts" sweat when I ask them all these questions ;-)

UI2 is intended to be controlled with a gyration remote.  That was its intent.  Controlling it with IR is possible, but as you are finding limited at times.
UI1 was intended for IR remote control.

Now where was that little gem of information hiding when I was planning my system!!

Thanks for the tips, J. I've actually experimented quite a bit with a Wiimote but one of the main reasons I'm not using this on this MD is because if I ever get my AV switching working, there will be no LinuxMCE on-screen-display while I'm controlling my settop box so the UI2-gyro-type controls will be of no use to me because you need the visual cues (on-screen arrows and things which show if you're controlling lights or volume).

As you point out, though, a combo remote would potentially solve that problem.

Hmmmm...

I could go back to UI1 but what I really like about UI2 is the constant media backdrop. I load all our family pics onto the screensaver and it is brilliant having them cycle the whole time in the background. I like UI2.

It really can't be that difficult to sort out this page-down issue, though.... and, hopefully, the jump to letter in the playlist. Otherwise, the IR remote is actually controlling it (UI2) very well for me and it's MUCH easier for my wife and children to work with. Also great having a "button" for pause, stop, mute, etc. Those are things you typically want to do in a hurry so to just pick up the remote and press the button works really well.

I will continue digging in the meantime. I think the next step is to review the logs and maybe get stuck into the code of the mediaplugin which I gather hands a lot of these things off to the various devices etc.

acald: Diiva ? Mmmmmmm
edit: Oh, I thought Diiva and HDBaseT were the same but I see they're similar but with slight differences.

I wasn't even aware of this and yet I've wired my home for it. What a smart guy.

Let's see if my local A/V specialists have any diiva-enabled devices ;-)

Seriously, though, what it tells me is that CEC is dead in the water. Sadly, HDMI will probably be around for a while as everyone gets done with their vested interests but are they likely to standardise on the control-protocol in this time? Probably not.

I'll pick this up again now that the transmitting part it working and try to get to the bottom of this. If you've got any sizeable number of titles in your media list, not being able to page down becomes a real pain. I'm finding I have to use the "search" facility to get to the performer/title I want but it would be nice to browse. Would also be nice to be able to use the "first letter" jump-to list which also doesn't seem possible with a basic IR remote.

Thanks for the help.

I've marked this as solved because as far as I can tell, all is working correctly. Sadly I can't be sure if the problem was on the USBUIRT device or related to the TV device template that I originally built (and hacked). The reason I can't isolate is that I deleted all these devices and re-added the USBUIRT and then, subsequently, a new TV template so I didn't isolate the problem. I would put it down to the TV template except for the fact that a related issue (see other thread) of USBUIRT dying on router reload has gone aways as well which makes me wonder.

Nevertheless, all appears well in the land of USBUIRT - it is receiving 100% and transmitting as, I believe, it should although I'm still having lots of fun getting the codes right and ensuring the IR is delivered etc etc. As suggested by Thom, I'll probably invest in a dual-head emitter to target my devices more accurately for a start and, do my level best to get discrete codes. Toggle is a nightmare!! My TV goes on and off all the time to the degree that I've taken the power code out of the template and I'm controlling it manually at this stage!

J: I don't think it was an IR code as such... not sure exactly what it was.... just something funny about the way I set up the device, perhaps. Possibly related to the stuff-up I made with all the embedded devices in the beginning. Still have to clean that all out of the DB.

Thom: Thanks for the tip- will check it out. I see from Xantech.com that there may even be a distributor on the s. tip of Africa!

Make no mistake, I'm having loads of fun trying to get IR control to work with my el-cheapo TV and STB and all that.... but, putting all that tinkering enjoyment aside for a moment, can we have a quick discussion about the future of device control?

Where does everyone think it is going? Is there some convergence happening in the industry?

Is everything going to move to HDMI-CEC, USB or IP control? Any thoughts? Would be good to know. I know CEC is poorly supported at present but it is an option. IP - lots of devices are getting both LAN and WAN connectors on board but most of these are for updating your twitface status primarily, correct? Will there come a time when we can do more with them? What about USB - that is also in just about every new AV device but, again, can one actually control the device via USB or is it just to be able to play your media.

I'm assuming that looking forward we should regard RS232 as over, despite how good it was and still is.  I'm going to put on some shoes and go and visit some high-end AUDIO/VIDEO vendors this week and pretend I have the buying power for some of their units and see what they have to say about control of their HT Receivers. Will be interesting.... ;-)

Cautiously optimistic....

Not going to mark it solved just yet but I'm holding thumbs here...

So looking at the log section below I figured that the transmission problem must be related to one of the 3 "on" commands that were sent prior to transmission failing. I tried manually sending the first (Onscreen orbiter) but that automatically fires the second and third so that doesn't help isolate the problem. I then tried just the 3rd (On to the TV) and that did cause the transmission to fail. So I began to suspect the TV device/template.

So I deleted the USBUIRT device from my tree (and hence the TV beneath it) and then re-added the USBUIRT.

Now, before adding the TV, I was able to test transmission using the webadmin and/or MessageSend commands directly. These worked, no matter what "state" the media director was in. So I figured the TV template was the problem. I created a new one, added it and, SO FAR SO GOOD! Transmission and Receiving seems to be working. Not only that but I think my receiving problem (after dcerouter reload) seems also to be resolved, yay!

Will wait a while and do a few more checks and tests, as well as deleting the old template (no mean achievemnt) before marking resolved.

Now if the TV would just respond to the IR commands... it seems pretty unreliable.

More info... OK, I don't think the Socket::ReceiveData failed is actually the problem because with further testing I see that successfully sent codes (the ones I can send prior to using the MD) show the same thing in the log but the code is sent, the UIRT flashes and the TV responds. So I *think* that's a red herring.

However, I had a closer look at the DCERouter log between the time I can send and the time I can't send and it seems that as soon as all the "on commands" are sent to the xxxxxx, the UIRT stops working immediately after:

Code:

05      02/16/13 0:08:02.902            Socket::ReceiveString2 ReceiveData failed m_Socket: -1 Incoming_Conn Socket 175 ::ffff:192.168.80.1 <0x69fdeb70>
05      02/16/13 0:08:02.902            TCPIP: Closing connection to -1003 (Router Dev #0) 0x9fab0028 m_Socket: -1 <0x69fdeb70>
05      02/16/13 0:08:02.902            Router::RemoveAndDeleteSocket 0x9fab0028 -1003 <0x69fdeb70>
08      02/16/13 0:08:14.431            Received Message from 156 (USB UIRT 0038 / TV Room) to 78 (OnScreen Orbiter / TV Room), type 1 id 203 Command:Move Right, retry none, parameters: <0x737f1b70>
08      02/16/13 0:08:14.434            Received Message from 78 (OnScreen Orbiter / TV Room) to 78 (OnScreen Orbiter / TV Room), type 1 id 192 Command:On, retry none, parameters: <0x79ffeb70>
08      02/16/13 0:08:14.434              Parameter 21(Force): 1 <0x79ffeb70>
08      02/16/13 0:08:14.434              Parameter 97(PK_Pipe): 0 <0x79ffeb70>
08      02/16/13 0:08:14.434              Parameter 98(PK_Device_Pipes):  <0x79ffeb70>
08      02/16/13 0:08:14.434            Received Message from 78 (OnScreen Orbiter / TV Room) to 76 (Zotac AD04 TV Room / TV Room), type 1 id 192 Command:On, retry none, parameters: <0xacdf9b70>
08      02/16/13 0:08:14.434              Parameter 21(Force): 1 <0xacdf9b70>
08      02/16/13 0:08:14.434              Parameter 97(PK_Pipe): 0 <0xacdf9b70>
08      02/16/13 0:08:14.434              Parameter 98(PK_Device_Pipes):  <0xacdf9b70>
08      02/16/13 0:08:14.434              Parameter 125(Already processed): 1 <0xacdf9b70>
08      02/16/13 0:08:14.434            Received Message from 78 (OnScreen Orbiter / TV Room) to 170 (40V86PE / TV Room), type 1 id 192 Command:On, retry none, parameters: <0xb77a8b70>
08      02/16/13 0:08:14.434              Parameter 98(PK_Device_Pipes):  <0xb77a8b70>
08      02/16/13 0:08:14.434            Received Message from 78 (OnScreen Orbiter / TV Room) to 170 (40V86PE / TV Room), type 1 id 91 Command:Input Select, retry none, parameters: <0xb77a8b70>
08      02/16/13 0:08:14.434              Parameter 71(PK_Command_Input(HDMI)): 361 <0xb77a8b70>

The log section above shows what happens as soon as I try to do something on the MD. Note that immediately prior to this, the UIRT was sending.
The first entry is the "move right" command, as received from my remote. This triggers an "On" command to the onscreen orbiter followed by an "On" command to the Media Director, followed by an "On" command to the TV and then an "Input select: HDMI" command to the TV.

That all makes sense.... (apart from the fact that the MD is already on and so is the TV).

But why, following this sequence, should the UIRT stop transmitting?

Ok, so here's what happens when I hit the "test code" from webadmin while my USBUIRT is in its "non transmitting" state:

DCERoute.log:

Code:

08      02/14/13 21:44:49.070           Received Message from 0 (unknown / ) to 157 (USB UIRT Embedded Transmit / TV Room), type 1 id 191 Command:Send Code, retry none, parameters: <0x6a09eb70>
08      02/14/13 21:44:49.070             Parameter 9(Text): 0000 0073 0000 000C 0020 0021 0020 0021 0040 0021 0020 0021 0020 0021 0020 0021 0020 0021 0020 0041 0040 0021 0020 0021 0020 0021 0020 0CC7 <0x6a09eb70>
05      02/14/13 21:44:49.120           Socket::ReceiveData 0xaeff6f08 failed, bytes left 0 start: 2320000 1: 0 1b: 0 2: 0 2b: 0 m_Socket: 175 Incoming_Conn Socket 175 ::ffff:127.0.0.1 <0x6a09eb70>
05      02/14/13 21:44:49.120           Socket::ReceiveString2 ReceiveData failed m_Socket: -1 Incoming_Conn Socket 175 ::ffff:127.0.0.1 <0x6a09eb70>
05      02/14/13 21:44:49.121           TCPIP: Closing connection to -1003 (Router Dev #0) 0xaeff6f08 m_Socket: -1 <0x6a09eb70>
05      02/14/13 21:44:49.121           Router::RemoveAndDeleteSocket 0xaeff6f08 -1003 <0x6a09eb70>

Help? Socket::ReceiveData failed. Why?

I don't mind latency issues when it comes to just sending commands, as long as the commands eventually get there.

Don't forget, latency will affect all messages, including "commands". So when you push the button on your remote, that sends a message to this device which sends a message to that plugin which forwards two messages to two other devices which then moves "up" one item on your onscreen menu. All of that goes over the network via the DCERouter (core). If you are happy to wait a bit between pressing the button on  your remote and the next menu item to be highlighted, then you know you're happy with latency.

OK, I sorted out the TV template and the connections pipes and I'm pretty sure everything is going correctly.

MD ====> Audio+Video ====> TV HDMI1 input
STB =====> Audio + Video ====> TV AV1 input

I confirmed that when I start up the media director, as soon as there is action, it transmits a "Toggle power" to the TV because it actually turns the TV on. But as soon as that has happened, there appears to be no more transmitting done. I would think that while using the MD, volume commands would be relayed to the TV but nothing is transmitted.
Then, if I hit the "STB" scenario, I would expect the USBUIRT to try to toggle the input selection on the TV to AV1 but nothing happens.
If I "Test" the TV av commands from the webadmin page, nothing happens.

Going to have to have an in-depth and close watch on the logs while this is all happening to see what the problem is. I gather the MediaPlugin is responsible for handing on IR commands so I maybe have to look at that code a bit and/or its log. Does it have a log?

OK, I think that has cleaned everything up a bit, thanks for the replies. I will post the Connection Wiz diagram shortly so others can see my connections. I was going to delete the TV Template and all embedded devices but I couldn't find a command on webadmin to do that so I ended up doing it all in the pluto_main database. Since I was in at that level, instead of deleting the TV, I just deleted the embedded devices I didn't need (all the inputs other than the tuner) along with their pipes/connections/controlled_via entries and so on. When it is all working I'll sync the template in case some other cheapskate wants to use the same TV.

I then re-ran the media player setup wiz (Sarah) and answered her questions about the connections with the result that now my MD connects both audio and video directly to the HDMI1 input and my STB connects both audio and video directly to the AV1 input.

It also meant I didn't get all those unnecessary scenarios that were auto generated last time.

I have to say, when you get things right, the Sarah "wizard" is BRILLIANT.

Sadly, it does not appear to have resolved my USBUIRT transmitting problem but I'll continue bugging you gurus on that thread.

When you say you did an initial install of mce version 8.10 - was this from the DVD (iso image burned to DVD)?

I think  you are possibly misunderstanding how it works. LinuxMCE at present only runs on Kubuntu 8.10 or 10.04 and comes "bundled" with that particular distribution. You can't install Kubuntu 12.4 and then MCE on top of that, I'm afraid.

If you're wanting to use Kubuntu 12.4 for other things (other than LinuxMCE) then my personal suggestion is to do it on a separate machine. Others have had quite a bit of success with virtual machines as well (create a VM on your 12.4 machine and install LinuxMCE onto that) which I guess is also an option if your machine is pretty resource-blessed.

But your LinuxMCE server is going to be a 24x7 dedicated machine which potentially controls all your automation, media, telecoms etc. It doesn't need massive processing power but it also doesn't want a bunch of other things messing about with the I/O and network which are the important parts of it.

I hope that helps for a bit of background. If you aren't wanting to go quite that far LinuxMCE may be overkill for your needs and you might be happier with something like agocontrol which may run on 12.4 (?)

Let us know what you're trying to achieve and I'm sure the smart guys can give some pointers.

To answer your question, though, from what you say I would imagine that you have replaced your 12.4 installation with an 8.10 installation so, yes, your updates are gone :-(