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Messages - skeptic

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Maybe I'm missing something, but if you lose power then either the other computers are on a UPS of their own (or are a laptop) or they are already down.  Unless of course it's just local to the core, knocked power cord out or tripped a breaker, in which case the other systems will continue to have power.  If the other computers have their own UPS it makes sense for each of them to monitor their own.

The ups/controlled shutdown on power loss is a good idea, I'm just a bit confused as to the benefit of trying to shutdown other systems when you lose power on the core.  

Installation issues / Re: No videos after install
« on: June 06, 2010, 11:13:54 pm »
External drives should be detected and prompt you to use them.  Did you by chance click the option not to use a drive and not to ask about it later?  If you said yes to use it and yes to use the lmce layout, you should see a /home/public/data/* filesystem structure where you can put your media.  If that's the videos folder you are talking about, and answered yes to use the drive, then the only other thing I can think of is you may have turned off the update media daemon.

Users / Re: How do you feel about
« on: June 06, 2010, 06:35:30 pm »
quickly looking over looks promising but I would need to investigate how updateMedia deals with changing names of files and whatnot. do we want to rename people's files?

I'm not sure I follow.  You are talking about the name within metadata right, not actually changing the actual filename on disk, right?  I would think you would want to set the name the first time the id3 files is created, but probably not after that. 

Users / Re: How do you feel about
« on: June 06, 2010, 04:17:05 am »
It might be worth while to check out jamu (Just Another Metadata Utility) as well.  The method of plugging data into the lmce would need to change, but the code for collection of that data may be useful.  It's written in python if that makes a difference.

Users / Re: WAF wins out.
« on: June 05, 2010, 08:47:10 pm »
Glad to see the thread is at least sorta back to the original intent.  After reading through my posts again as well as others I can see where some of the reactionary stuff comes from.  I'm not going to apologize for anything, but if I could start over I would have left a few things out and worded things a bit differently. 

The biggest "tiny little thing" that may have helped the thread go where I was hoping would be to call the original list "things to think about" instead of suggestions.  Really, that's all I wanted to accomplish.  Hope to get more of us thinking about ways to attract more people, both users and devs, to LinuxMCE.  I tried to avoid specifics, although I did mention the "reload router"  "regenerate orbiter" stuff because it comes up all the time and the wife always lets out a big "this again" type hmm and as far as I'm aware it's something that has never been discussed.  Or if/when the orbiter is re-written it becomes a non-issue.  It may be completely impractical to get away from it, I freely admit I have no clue.  But in the spirit of "lets think about ways to improve the end user experience" I felt it was worth at least mentioning. 


*tosses hari another bag of popcorn*

Users / Re: AcerRevo 3610 atom330 ION MD on 8.10 core:
« on: June 05, 2010, 02:04:54 am »
Sorry to hear that - did you enable the alternate ROM for the network card in bios?  That was the one thing I had to do.  I'm not sure why you are having issues when it "just worked" for me without jumping through hoops (other than the alternate ROM thing).  If you want I can check my bios for specific settings, just let me know what you want checked. 

FWIW, I still have WIFI enabled.  My network cable has the tab broke off the end and a couple times it was loose and booted into Windows 7 with full Internet access.

Users / Re: WAF wins out.
« on: June 05, 2010, 01:35:23 am »
You are either clueless or a troll.  Clearly unable to understand what I have written while trying to change the meaning around.  No point in trying to explain what has already been explained, you'll never get it.  Thank you for staying out of my thread, now that you've turned it into a flame war.

Mods - you may as well lock this thread, it's pointless now.

Users / Re: WAF wins out.
« on: June 04, 2010, 08:08:07 pm »
<useless drivel removed>

Again, it is weightless to the intended reader. They need help, you don't help, then "suggest" they:
*rip out, rewrite, or otherwise get away from any proprietary code.  LinuxMCE needs FOSS programmers, some FOSS programmers may shy away from a project built from and still limited by non-free licensing, even if it's just some areas.

Drop pluto. Brilliant. I mean... I just don't even know how to address that. You seem to basically want mythbuntu with a couple of the "features" of lmce.
I would not go so far as to call it brilliant, but as a long term goal it's important.  If I'm not mistaken, it's also in the plan.

*stop chasing away potential users and developers.  Rude belittling posts do nothing but hurt the project.  

Not a criticism obviously... just a suggestion eh? I don't like the way Thom talks to me either... but until he says something that is INCORRECT in a condescending way... he is kind enough to waste his time explaining things to me. His frustrations are logical and blunt. I prefer people that way. It's honest... grow a thicker skin.
Don't worry about me, my skin is plenty thick.  I just hate to see other people driven away.  This was not directed at Thom, BTW.

*listen to the users.  If a question or complaint comes up often, there is a reason.  

Implies they do not. My limited comprehension reading this board has led me to a very different conclusion. The board itself exists for that function.
Agreed, but the prevailing attitude, which you have perpetuated here in this thread, is the opinions of users don't matter.  Only those that contribute an arbitrary "enough" should be allowed to comment.

I am not going to go line by line anymore. I see that you are naively unaware that the post is insulting. At this point I am fueling something negative here, bumping the post. I wish you luck... and more dimension.
Perhaps you should grow thicker skin.  Suggesting improvements or pointing out deficiencies should not be taken as insults.  Without your input this thread would have been far less negative.

Users / Re: WAF wins out.
« on: June 04, 2010, 06:57:34 pm »
l3mce - I'm not going to get into a pissing contest over how much easier one product is than another.  I'm fine with LinuxMCE, the wife thinks other options are easier to use and look nicer.  End of discussion.  Clearly you have issues with reading comprehension as well, but thank you for taking the time to search through my older posts and quote one that supports what I am saying in this thread. 

It is the same product. Scheduling functions the same way because it is the same interface. There is no discussion to be had. If your wife cannot, after a single explanation, "work it"... I do not see how that would change.
It's not a question of her being able to, she can.  LMCE adds an extra layer on top.  LMCE -> MythTV (dumps you into live tv) -> back out to the MythTV menu (different look and feel from LMCE main menu).  From there it's the same.  That was just one random example, but clearly you are living in denial so you just be happy with yourself.

Your quoted post, while still whining that it isn't good enough, is in contrast to what you are saying now, and supported by your decision to move to the "eye candy" option you did not think LinuxMCE should go.
Reading comprehension owns you.  Most everyone agrees LMCE would benefit form a face-lift.  That doesn't mean eye-candy.  I switched to MythTV because it's the option my wife likes better. 

What did you expect this thread to accomplish? That everyone would drop the current product and re-engineer it to suit you so you will come back? Seriously? If you want a feature, make it. If you want to criticize it, you might want to contribute first to lend your opinion weight. My opinion has no weight... that is why I bother talking to you about this. It is not your place, nor mine, to complain about what "I think it should do" or state the obvious as if it is a revelation. There is nothing of merit in your contradictory posts, and this thread serves no purpose but to offend... my reading comprehension not withstanding.
Don't confuse suggestions with criticism.  The amount of contribution one makes has no bearing on the validity of a suggestion.  Sure, it carries more weight if a main dev suggests something, but that doesn't in and of itself make it more valid.

My posts do not contradict each other in any way.  This thread was never intended to offend, but it did go off-track a bit, thanks largely to you.  I don't expect anyone here to care what product I use or make major changes to keep me using LMCE.  The only thing I hoped to accomplish was to get people thinking about ways to attract people to the project, expand the user and developer base.  Few (none?) are new ideas, but no harm in mentioning them again. 

Users / Re: AcerRevo 3610 atom330 ION MD on 8.10 core:
« on: June 04, 2010, 06:04:44 pm »
Not sure if it will help, but all I did to get my Acer Revo 3610 working was to go into bios and enable alternate nic rom (or something like that).  I'm not sure if mine came with a newer bios, but I have not updated it.

Users / Re: WAF wins out.
« on: June 04, 2010, 05:38:24 pm »
Didn't mean to start an uproar.  Let me see if I can respond to some of the main points/questions.

The stuff directed toward Thom was a reaction to his original reply.  I don't want to dwell on it, but my comments refer to his posting and attitude toward others, NOT on his contributions as a dev.  There seems to be somewhat of a confrontational tone between devs (and others) and anyone wanting to make a suggestion.   I've seen people join the forum, say they are a coder or want to learn, then get chased off when they suggest ideas or new approaches.  I wasn't singling out or implying anyone specific in my first post.

PXE boot - I think I may have been misunderstood, I would not want to see PXE booting go away.  I do think the ability to install a MD on a local drive and boot from it could be handy in certain circumstances.  Mainly for things like a wireless laptop that may move around.  In fact, I'm PXE booting a MythTV frontend now.  Very handy feature that I wouldn't want to see go away.

WAF - simply put, she doesn't like the interface and finds the Myth one more intuitive.  I/we have never used a webpad mobile orbiter, she may have been happy had I bought one for her to use. 

I wasn't trying to make a big deal about leaving.  Quite the contrary.  I was trying to throw out ideas to help LMCE appeal to a larger audience.  I started with 0704, ran 0710 for most of the time, then switched to 0810 beta.  I want LMCE to succeed, I want it to grow and become the standard by which all other media centers are judged.  Yes, LMCE is far more than just a media center, but that's how it's going to be seen and compared to by others.  Sometimes I think people here get tunnel vision and it helps to get another point of view.

l3mce - I'm not going to get into a pissing contest over how much easier one product is than another.  I'm fine with LMCE, the wife thinks other options are easier to use and look nicer.  End of discussion.  Clearly you have issues with reading comprehension as well, but thank you for taking the time to search through my older posts and quote one that supports what I am saying in this thread. 

Users / Re: WAF wins out.
« on: June 04, 2010, 06:50:50 am »
Yes, I have modified the post...

A good number of your points are valid, however, there is only so much the developers can do with limited time and resources. We need help,

You haven't been following any development discussions, so how could you possibly know how things are going?

I am a bit miffed at your tone of, "make it nice and perfect and MAYBE i'll come back." but I'm sure that was unintentional.


Since you modified the post after I started my last reply, then was away from my computer for a bit, let me reply to this directly.

I'm still going to leave my original reply as is because your "don't let the door hit you on the way out" is far too common and I think my reply is valid.  Ok, I may have been a bit unfairly harsh, but I'm leaving my knee-jerk reaction to your knee-jerk reaction.

I'm not a coder.  Probably never will be.  I'm a Unix admin.  As part of my unix work I sometimes do ksh scripting all day long.  I've also done a bit of python programming.  The LAST thing I want to do after work is code especially if it means learning/re-learning a language.  I don't follow the dev forums, although I do pick up the occasional bit here and there, such as the plan to re-write the orbiter.

My tone may have come across as "make it perfect and maybe I'll come back" but it certainly wasn't meant that way.  To put it simple:  My wife does not like the LinuxMCE interface so I finally gave in and switched to MythTV, now she is happy.  I plan to come back to LMCE as soon as it's user friendly enough that she is ok with it.  I have confidence that this will be the case once the orbiter has been re-written.  I'm technical, she is not.  Things that I, and most everyone here, are fine with she sees as ugly, unintuitive, or a hassle.  I think it would do everyone some good to sit down with a non-technical person with no LMCE exposure and get their honest opinion.

My suggestions, and they are only suggestions, are based on what I have seen here and with other projects like MythTV.  Additional coders will come with a larger user base.  A larger user base will come with easier, more flexible install and a more user friendly UI.

Users / Re: WAF wins out.
« on: June 04, 2010, 06:29:35 am »
Typical responses.  My second point in fact - rude belittling posts hidden behind a a thin veil of sarcasm.

Hand a guest in your home who has never seen LMCE a remote and tell them to set a program to record any time it comes on.  

You don't have to like my suggestions, or even agree with them.  I'm just trying to be honest and unbiased.  If anything, I'm biased in favor of LMCE.  

Thom - as much as you have contributed to this project and as much good as you have done, LinuxMCE would be better off without you.  Or at least better if you were banned from the user forum.  Stick to coding and leave the PR to others.  Newsflash - not everyone's life revolves around LMCE.  You can claim I have a complete lack of contribution, disregard 2+ years of answering what I could in the forums and what little of my posts made it to the wiki.  I understand your ego is fragile and anyone that doesn't submit code to the project is inferior to you, has no valid opinion, and are only to be tolerated but not allowed to speak freely.   You did notice this was posted in the users forum right?

BTW, I didn't say I was leaving.  I said I was going to hang around, watch how things progress, maybe even setup a test box for LMCE.  In fact, I specifically said I hope to replace Myth with LMCE in the future.  Think of my going back to MythTV as a temporary thing while the usability issues are worked out.

If the goal of the project is still to make a simple to setup, simple  to use, all-in-one appliance type device you HAVE to listen to the users.  Who is the target audience for the future?  If it's techies or people who are willing to learn lots of detailed stuff like most everyone here in order to get the functionality of LMCE, then things are fine the way they are.  I am fine with the learning curve.  If the target audience is non-technical people or those who just want things to be easy to use without a steep learning curve then the opinions of people like my wife should be important. 

Or just continue the way things are, keep chasing people away while begging people to help.  Keep all the options limited with a high learning curve to weed out anyone that may want to just download it for and use a hassle free system.  Ignore all the reasons why other options such as boxee, xbmc, mythtv, etc. are more successful.  And most important of all, ignore the suggestions by those of us who have been using LinuxMCE for a while. 

Users / WAF wins out.
« on: June 03, 2010, 10:42:09 pm »
Well guys, I hate to admit it but the wife has been somewhat unhappy with LMCE from the start.  She loves the idea of a central media center and various frontend MDs, as well as the potential for all the home automation stuff, integrated security and phone system, etc.  Unfortunately she hates the interface.  Ugly, non-intuitive, sometimes glitchy.  She wants to be able pick up a remote and have everything make sense, not need to learn where stuff is or how to do things. 

Since I had a spare 500G SATA drive in my closet, I went ahead and installed Mythbuntu for her to try.  The wife is happy with it, so it looks like I'll be stepping away from linuxmce for a while.  To be completely honest, I like it much better myself except for the lack of HA features.

I'll be keeping an eye on LinuxMCE.  After the orbiter re-write I hope to come back - there is so much potential functionality I want to use.  Unfortunately user friendliness is just not there.  LinuxMCE is also quite glitchy, but I've been using 810 BETA, it's expected.

Don't take this as a typical LinuxMCE sucks, I'm using something else type post.  If anything, think of it as a reminder of what is important to end users - the user experience.  I know some of the devs here get uptight and defensive when any criticism is given, but lets try to get past that.  I want LinuxMCE to succeed.  I think it has the potential to be great.  I know it's early in it's life and is trying to shake off the shackles of the commercial product that spawned it.  As an end user that has been using and following this project for more than 2 years let me throw out a few general suggestions:

*rip out, rewrite, or otherwise get away from any proprietary code.  LMCE needs FOSS programmers, some FOSS programmers may shy away from a project built from and still limited by non-free licensing, even if it's just some areas.
*stop chasing away potential users and developers.  Rude belittling posts do nothing but hurt the project. 
*listen to the users.  If a question or complaint comes up often, there is a reason. 
*more linux standard stuff, less wizardy stuff.  Think of how many people run into the "black screen, press 1, 2, 3, etc." on hardware where a standard linux install works fine. 
*If at all possible, get this to run on other distros.
*Do not force PXE booted MDs.  Net booting is nice, it's slick, but sometimes being able to boot a MD from a local HD is a better option.
*Put an end to the constand "need to reload router" and "need to regenerate orbiter" stuff. 

Of course these are all suggestions, nobody can demand or even expect the devs to work on anything they don't want to (unless they are being directly paid for specific items).  I'll still be lurking from time to time, I may even setup a test environment and continue to play around.

Users / Re: LED Hdtv Vs LCD Vs Plasma.
« on: June 02, 2010, 03:14:31 am »
I recently bought a Sharp Aquos, 60" standard LCD.  Price was right, picture is great, consistently high reviews.  For a bit more money they have the LED LCD range with a few other improvments.  As totallymaxed mentioned, LCDs are similar quality picture to plasma without the (potential) drawbacks.  I still think plasma has better fast motion picture, but LCDs have tricks to help with the flickering.  Local dimming LEDs (different from edge light LEDs) are going to be the best option in the near future, unless you are really keen on the slimness only edge lit LEDs can deliver, but the local dimming ones are still expensive and hard to find.

So, if you are looking for a flat screen TV that integrates into LMCE, I'll pass on the recommendation given to me that I followed and suggest a Sharp Aquos LCD.  From there, your wants and budget can lead you to the right one.

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