LinuxMCE Forums

General => Users => Topic started by: rednus on April 08, 2009, 02:41:07 pm

Title: New Bee Here.. want to setup LMCE..
Post by: rednus on April 08, 2009, 02:41:07 pm
Hello LMCE Gurus,

I have been thinking of automate my home for some time now.. Now I am starting to put it to plan.. my plan is to build the core first.. automate security(Z-wave), lighting(Z-wave), media(powerline), telephony(asterix) one by one in order..

for the starter.. I am planning to build my Hybrid Core which will sit in first floor home cinema room with the following config.. please help me if i am missing anything.. (Please note I am from UK)

Black Opera ATX Desktop Case 500W PSU (20+4 pin)2x 5.25bays, 2x3.25bays, 3fans, 7expansion slots, 2x front usb and front av ports
Asus M4N78 Pro ATX, AM2+, NVIDIA GeForce 8300, Hybrid SLI, 3 x PCI (32 bit), 1 x PCI-E 2.0 (x16), 2 x PCI-E x1, 6x SATA 3gbps, 8USB, HDMI, SPDIF, RAID, 1x IDE
AMD Athlon 64 X2 7750+2.7GHz 2Core, 128KBx2 L1, 512KBx2 L2, 1MBx2 L3
Arctic Cooling Freezer 64 Pro V292mm vertical cooler
Corsair TwinX DDR2 XMS2 2GBx21066FSB
500 GB Maxtor STM3500320AS DiamondMax 22 x232MB Buffer, 8.5ms, 2 discs will be on RAID
Optiarc AD-7200S-0D 20x DVDRWDVD dual layer writer

This will be the basic core.. PCIs & USBs will be added as the installation progress..
Also I wanted to use 2GB or 4GB IDE Flash drive to install my OS on to.. but not sure if that is a good idea or not..

please let me know your views, ideas and suggestions..

thanks
rednus
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: tricky_dicky on April 08, 2009, 05:24:41 pm
Hi rednus,

That system looks ok, I presume you have already had a good look through the wiki to check if it's all compatible?!?! I doubt if you will need 4Gb of RAM but that's up to you.

Just thought I would mention; you say you are planning on installing things like security, lighting,media and asterisk one at a time well LMCE will install it all and then you will just have to configure them as you are ready.  If I were you I would get as much equipment ready as possible for when you do the first install so you have at least got something to play with.

Also, is that all the storage you are planning on having or have you got a NAS box for all your data?

Good luck

Rich
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: rednus on April 08, 2009, 05:31:43 pm
Quote from: tricky_dicky on April 08, 2009, 05:24:41 pm
Hi rednus,

That system looks ok, I presume you have already had a good look through the wiki to check if it's all compatible?!?! I doubt if you will need 4Gb of RAM but that's up to you.

Just thought I would mention; you say you are planning on installing things like security, lighting,media and asterisk one at a time well LinuxMCE will install it all and then you will just have to configure them as you are ready.  If I were you I would get as much equipment ready as possible for when you do the first install so you have at least got something to play with.

Also, is that all the storage you are planning on having or have you got a NAS box for all your data?

Good luck

Rich

Hi tricky_dicky, thanks for the reply.. yes i have been thru the hardware wiki.. and what i meant about the installation is about implementation but not really about installing the software.. for the moment 1TB is the storage.. in future i will extend it with additional storage or external sata drives..

the problem with having as much equipment is sourcing all the products and getting them delivered in time for installation.. not the pc products.. but z-wave and other products.. i am still trying to find out best z-wave switches etc..

thanks for the tip though..

regards, rednus
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: tkmedia on April 08, 2009, 05:37:19 pm
I would not use a CF card for the O/S,  currently your TV show are recorded to your O/S drive.

Also the nic on that Mobo may require an updated drivers as well as your Video card.



HTH

Tim
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: rednus on April 08, 2009, 08:48:14 pm
Quote from: tkmedia on April 08, 2009, 05:37:19 pm
I would not use a CF card for the O/S,  currently your TV show are recorded to your O/S drive.

Also the nic on that Mobo may require an updated drivers as well as your Video card.



HTH

Tim

Thanks m8.. I realised that after some reading.. now i have to use another 160GB SATA for my OS Drive.. :-) An extra 20quid for the budget..

Another Q, how much swap is recomended..
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: rednus on April 08, 2009, 08:51:03 pm
Another question, the current MoBo I chose, already have 1 NIC on board.. And I have a sky ADSL wireless router with 4 lan ports.. Do i need to add another NIC card to make my core work as DHCP server and gateway..

is there any way to make my core as DHCP server and gateway only for MCE devices and other devices use the wireless router..

or is there a way to use the wireless router for all the devices as Gateway and still connect to core?

THanks in advance..
rednus
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: rednus on April 08, 2009, 08:53:00 pm
Quote from: tkmedia on April 08, 2009, 05:37:19 pm
I would not use a CF card for the O/S,  currently your TV show are recorded to your O/S drive.

Also the nic on that Mobo may require an updated drivers as well as your Video card.

HTH

Tim

Another Q, is it ok to have MD's with CF or solid state or even with less HDD like 40 or 80gig..

Regarding Network connectivity to MD's, will HomePlug AV with 200mbps do? or do i need to run Lan cable all over the house?

thanks
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: totallymaxed on April 08, 2009, 08:55:47 pm
Quote from: rednus on April 08, 2009, 08:48:14 pm
Quote from: tkmedia on April 08, 2009, 05:37:19 pm
I would not use a CF card for the O/S,  currently your TV show are recorded to your O/S drive.

Also the nic on that Mobo may require an updated drivers as well as your Video card.



HTH

Tim

Thanks m8.. I realised that after some reading.. now i have to use another 160GB SATA for my OS Drive.. :-) An extra 20quid for the budget..

Another Q, how much swap is recomended..

Dont worry about the swap space...use the DVD installer and just use the defaults.

Andrew

Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: Pnuts on April 08, 2009, 08:57:01 pm
for the Core\hybrid, your going to want a 2nd NIC.

Short answer: if you want the system to work teh way it is designed, use 2 NIC's

if you do not, you will run into many problems and not get much in terms of support and help, so if your not a linux guru, go with the recomended configuration.

---

As for the power line network, I think it depends on how far you take this and how much data your pushing in the end. An example is 1 HDhomerun using both tuners is using about 80mb/s of the network. If your keeping it simple and small, it should work for you.
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: tschak909 on April 08, 2009, 08:58:12 pm
Sending packets in an AC carrier over powerlines is _very_ problematic, and you'll experience all sorts of weird things that happen over the course of a day, such as connections flaking out when the AC or dishwasher or washer/dryer turns on....

For simple signalling of lights/dimmers/etc, this is fine, and the protocols have inherent safeguards to try to deal with this (well, everything BUT x-10, but i digress.)... but modulating an ethernet like protocol over an inherently noisy wire is just plain stupid. Sorry.

Don't skimp on your interconnect, or you will regret it.

-Thom
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: totallymaxed on April 08, 2009, 09:02:31 pm
Quote from: rednus on April 08, 2009, 08:53:00 pm
Quote from: tkmedia on April 08, 2009, 05:37:19 pm
I would not use a CF card for the O/S,  currently your TV show are recorded to your O/S drive.

Also the nic on that Mobo may require an updated drivers as well as your Video card.

HTH

Tim

Another Q, is it ok to have MD's with CF or solid state or even with less HDD like 40 or 80gig..

Regarding Network connectivity to MD's, will HomePlug AV with 200mbps do? or do i need to run Lan cable all over the house?

thanks

The MD PXE boot from your Core over the LAN so no need for any local hard drives in those at all :-)

We sometimes use 200Mbit HomePlug adapters in installations where there is no CAT5 or where the customer is not doing any major refit work. They can work really well... but its all down to the local mains wiring in the property and also partly driven by noise on the mains ring created by Fridges and other motorised 'White goods'... this is so variable you cannot generalise at all on the likelihood of HomePlug working acceptabley or not. We have seen brand new properties fail to work well with HomePlug and conversely 450 year old Barn's with 1920's wiring work fantastically well!!!!

'Suck it and see' is the only way i'm afraid ;-)

All the best

Andrew
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: rednus on April 09, 2009, 12:43:52 am
Quote from: totallymaxed on April 08, 2009, 09:02:31 pm
The MD PXE boot from your Core over the LAN so no need for any local hard drives in those at all :-)

Andrew

Andrew, is it not possible to boot it directly from the MD if it has a hard drive.. for example i am planning to use asus b202 or b206 as my MD which have 160Gb hard drive..
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: rednus on April 09, 2009, 12:55:06 am
Quote from: totallymaxed on April 08, 2009, 09:02:31 pm
The MD PXE boot from your Core over the LAN so no need for any local hard drives in those at all :-)

Andrew

Andrew, I see that you are from Dianemo, could you please suggest me few options here..

1. Which DVB card to use (for freeview or freesat)
2. How to integrate sky box
3. where to buy Zwave products in UK, i have browsed thru some of the zwave products, but i did not understand all of them, i am looking for items that will replace standard UK switches & dimmers, UK power sockets, motion sensors and door/window contacts and also a fire alarm (BTW, I already have a BT Home monitor made by intamac, do you know if they are compatible with zwave?)
4. where to buy asterix cards in UK?

Also am I missing anything in my config?

Thanks for your advice in advance..
rednus
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: colinjones on April 09, 2009, 01:13:15 am
Quote from: rednus on April 09, 2009, 12:43:52 am
Quote from: totallymaxed on April 08, 2009, 09:02:31 pm
The MD PXE boot from your Core over the LAN so no need for any local hard drives in those at all :-)

Andrew

Andrew, is it not possible to boot it directly from the MD if it has a hard drive.. for example i am planning to use asus b202 or b206 as my MD which have 160Gb hard drive..

Not presently, this option is not available (but might be added back in later) - in the meantime, seriously, just switch it to PXE boot and turn it on. With the Eee boxes and a few other recent nettops, etc there are sometimes a few little things you need to work around, but Andrew has already documented all that on the wiki. Generally, you just switch on a piece of hardware in PXE mode, the core finds it and sets it all up. From then on it just boots from the network, its all very efficient and you won't have problems with performance.

Reinforcing the network requirements, particularly the 2 NIC thing - http://wiki.linuxmce.org/index.php/Network_Setup

And yes, 4GB is way overkill! It is unlikely you will need more than 2GB for your core and 1GB for your MD, although less also works quite well!
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: rednus on April 09, 2009, 01:52:22 am
Quote from: colinjones on April 09, 2009, 01:13:15 am
Quote from: rednus on April 09, 2009, 12:43:52 am
Quote from: totallymaxed on April 08, 2009, 09:02:31 pm
The MD PXE boot from your Core over the LAN so no need for any local hard drives in those at all :-)

Andrew

Andrew, is it not possible to boot it directly from the MD if it has a hard drive.. for example i am planning to use asus b202 or b206 as my MD which have 160Gb hard drive..

Not presently, this option is not available (but might be added back in later) - in the meantime, seriously, just switch it to PXE boot and turn it on. With the Eee boxes and a few other recent nettops, etc there are sometimes a few little things you need to work around, but Andrew has already documented all that on the wiki. Generally, you just switch on a piece of hardware in PXE mode, the core finds it and sets it all up. From then on it just boots from the network, its all very efficient and you won't have problems with performance.

Reinforcing the network requirements, particularly the 2 NIC thing - http://wiki.linuxmce.org/index.php/Network_Setup

And yes, 4GB is way overkill! It is unlikely you will need more than 2GB for your core and 1GB for your MD, although less also works quite well!

Thanks for the reply colinjones.. why i wanted to see that feature is the time it takes to pxe boot.. i want to completely turn off the MDs instead of standby using Zwave wall plug sockets..

thanks for the suggestion.. that will save some money for the second NIC card.. i already have another wireless router somewhere in the attic.. so i can use that for separate LMCE network..
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: colinjones on April 09, 2009, 03:32:00 am
Quote from: rednus on April 09, 2009, 01:52:22 am
thanks for the suggestion.. that will save some money for the second NIC card.. i already have another wireless router somewhere in the attic.. so i can use that for separate LinuxMCE network..

I don't follow that at all?
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: rednus on April 09, 2009, 10:09:28 am
Quote from: colinjones on April 09, 2009, 03:32:00 am
Quote from: rednus on April 09, 2009, 01:52:22 am
thanks for the suggestion.. that will save some money for the second NIC card.. i already have another wireless router somewhere in the attic.. so i can use that for separate LinuxMCE network..

I don't follow that at all?

Sorry I meant, buying only 2GB ram will save me money so that i can buy an additional NIC card which was not originally in my plan.. but decided later..

btw.. anybody using Zyxel's new Homeplug AV200 and G+ Router for their network?
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: purps on April 09, 2009, 11:55:58 am
Quote from: colinjones on April 09, 2009, 03:32:00 am
Quote from: rednus on April 09, 2009, 01:52:22 am
thanks for the suggestion.. that will save some money for the second NIC card.. i already have another wireless router somewhere in the attic.. so i can use that for separate LinuxMCE network..

I don't follow that at all?

Seperate LMCE network? I would invest in a decent switch to connect everything together, and use your spare wireless router as a wireless access point (also plugged into the switch).
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: rednus on April 09, 2009, 12:12:49 pm
Quote from: purps on April 09, 2009, 11:55:58 am
Quote from: colinjones on April 09, 2009, 03:32:00 am
Quote from: rednus on April 09, 2009, 01:52:22 am
thanks for the suggestion.. that will save some money for the second NIC card.. i already have another wireless router somewhere in the attic.. so i can use that for separate LinuxMCE network..

I don't follow that at all?

Seperate LinuxMCE network? I would invest in a decent switch to connect everything together, and use your spare wireless router as a wireless access point (also plugged into the switch).

I would do that too if i have an option.. but i have to use the ISP's(SKY-UK) router to get the broadband.. dont have another option to change that ADSL Router.. so will have to use another router or switch create a LMCE network.. also some time i connect to office from home, and i dont want my office laptop to connect to my LMCE network.. so in that case i can directly use the ISPs router.. and for the LMCE network, I have ordered ZyXel's Wired, wireless and Homeplug router.. so my LMCE devices can use whatever as per their requirement..
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: ivanp on April 09, 2009, 01:04:04 pm
Quote from: rednus on April 09, 2009, 12:12:49 pm
I would do that too if i have an option.. but i have to use the ISP's(SKY-UK) router to get the broadband.. dont have another option to change that ADSL Router.. so will have to use another router or switch create a LinuxMCE network.. also some time i connect to office from home, and i dont want my office laptop to connect to my LinuxMCE network.. so in that case i can directly use the ISPs router.. and for the LinuxMCE network, I have ordered ZyXel's Wired, wireless and Homeplug router.. so my LinuxMCE devices can use whatever as per their requirement..

Rednus, seems to me that You havent understood LinuxMCE structure and posibilitys. LMCE is a router for Your internal network, so YOu just need a switch to connect all other machines to LMCEs network..
Start with this Wiki articles:
http://wiki.linuxmce.org/index.php/Network_Settings
http://wiki.linuxmce.org/index.php/DHCP_Plug_and_Play
http://wiki.linuxmce.org/index.php/FAQ

If You still have any other questions come here and we will try to help You.
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: rednus on April 09, 2009, 01:28:32 pm
Quote from: ivanp on April 09, 2009, 01:04:04 pm
Quote from: rednus on April 09, 2009, 12:12:49 pm
I would do that too if i have an option.. but i have to use the ISP's(SKY-UK) router to get the broadband.. dont have another option to change that ADSL Router.. so will have to use another router or switch create a LinuxMCE network.. also some time i connect to office from home, and i dont want my office laptop to connect to my LinuxMCE network.. so in that case i can directly use the ISPs router.. and for the LinuxMCE network, I have ordered ZyXel's Wired, wireless and Homeplug router.. so my LinuxMCE devices can use whatever as per their requirement..

Rednus, seems to me that You havent understood LinuxMCE structure and posibilitys. LinuxMCE is a router for Your internal network, so YOu just need a switch to connect all other machines to LMCEs network..
Start with this Wiki articles:
http://wiki.linuxmce.org/index.php/Network_Settings
http://wiki.linuxmce.org/index.php/DHCP_Plug_and_Play
http://wiki.linuxmce.org/index.php/FAQ

If You still have any other questions come here and we will try to help You.

Hi ivanp, think i do understand a bit.. what i did is bought a ZyXel router which can do wireless, wired and powerline.. although zyxel is a router.. i will be disabling DHCP and LMCE core will the DHCP server and gateway.. my existing router will be used for devices that i want outside LMCE network.. I know that i could do with a simple switch.. but i wanted wireless, wired and powerline devices in my LMCE network..
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: ivanp on April 09, 2009, 03:19:43 pm
Quote from: rednus on April 09, 2009, 01:28:32 pm
Hi ivanp, think i do understand a bit.. what i did is bought a ZyXel router which can do wireless, wired and powerline.. although zyxel is a router.. i will be disabling DHCP and LinuxMCE core will the DHCP server and gateway.. my existing router will be used for devices that i want outside LinuxMCE network.. I know that i could do with a simple switch.. but i wanted wireless, wired and powerline devices in my LinuxMCE network..

Your way is ok, i think all routers act as switch if You dont plug in anything into WAN port. Although i prefer simple switch in which You can plug in WAP (wireles acess point). Wap can manage ALL of your wireless equipment. If You plan to use Web DT366 as on Orbiter make sure You DONT use WPA protection because Web DT cant handle it. Simple MAC filtering can get You far. All WAPs can act as DHCP client and therefore just serve as "passthrough" and leave DHCP to LMCE.
I dont know much about Powerline technology, but i am sure You will have some sort of inteferenices whith fridges, air conditiong and stuff. Search here for details, i cam across some day on a thread discussing this. I remeber i saw Totallymaxed discussing it.
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: rednus on April 09, 2009, 03:56:11 pm
Quote from: ivanp on April 09, 2009, 03:19:43 pm
I dont know much about Powerline technology, but i am sure You will have some sort of inteferenices whith fridges, air conditiong and stuff. Search here for details, i cam across some day on a thread discussing this. I remeber i saw Totallymaxed discussing it.

Hi Thanks for the tip.. I too have read a lot about interference with fridges and washing machines etc.. but i dont want to run CAT5 all over my house.. its three floors, too much of cable and too much of trouble to do DIY.. so i am taking a chance with Powerline.. my house is new built (2007), so guess the power cables are good quality and high items on different phase(hopefully), even if not, my washing machine and dishwasher run only at night (i.e. we switch'em on when we off to sleep).. the only thing that runs always is the fridge.. so need to see whether it causes any trouble..

another thing i wanted to ask is, if i have a MD which has both wired(from powerline) and wireless network cards, can I bridge these two to get most out it.. anybody tried to do this? the switch/router i have is 125mbps G+, and will get about 100 to 200mbps on powerline..
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: Pnuts on April 09, 2009, 05:50:05 pm
Quote from: rednus on April 09, 2009, 12:12:49 pm
Quote from: purps on April 09, 2009, 11:55:58 am
Quote from: colinjones on April 09, 2009, 03:32:00 am
Quote from: rednus on April 09, 2009, 01:52:22 am
thanks for the suggestion.. that will save some money for the second NIC card.. i already have another wireless router somewhere in the attic.. so i can use that for separate LinuxMCE network..

I don't follow that at all?

Seperate LinuxMCE network? I would invest in a decent switch to connect everything together, and use your spare wireless router as a wireless access point (also plugged into the switch).

I would do that too if i have an option.. but i have to use the ISP's(SKY-UK) router to get the broadband.. dont have another option to change that ADSL Router.. so will have to use another router or switch create a LinuxMCE network.. also some time i connect to office from home, and i dont want my office laptop to connect to my LinuxMCE network.. so in that case i can directly use the ISPs router.. and for the LinuxMCE network, I have ordered ZyXel's Wired, wireless and Homeplug router.. so my LinuxMCE devices can use whatever as per their requirement..

I am planning on doing a similair thing. I am leaving a router in place and cascading the network down to the LMCE Core so i have essentially 2 networks. This benifits me in a couple of ways. Wireless internet is available during a core reinstall or if its down for any reason. Also wife doesnt complain about no internet in these cases. Plus im still learning Linux in general while I know the router inside and out for configurations and settings.

at the bottom of my wiki page is what I eventually plan to do, just waiting on some hardware to arrive. http://wiki.linuxmce.org/index.php/User:Pnuts
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: rednus on April 09, 2009, 08:54:14 pm
Quote from: Pnuts on April 09, 2009, 05:50:05 pm
I am planning on doing a similair thing. I am leaving a router in place and cascading the network down to the LinuxMCE Core so i have essentially 2 networks. This benifits me in a couple of ways. Wireless internet is available during a core reinstall or if its down for any reason. Also wife doesnt complain about no internet in these cases. Plus im still learning Linux in general while I know the router inside and out for configurations and settings.

at the bottom of my wiki page is what I eventually plan to do, just waiting on some hardware to arrive. http://wiki.linuxmce.org/index.php/User:Pnuts

Hi Pnuts, welcome to linux world.. hope the experience will be sweet and easy for you..

i am myself a linux geek since college but this is my first MCE installation.. so hoping to get all things sorted out without issues.. ;)

keep posting..


rednus
Title: Re: New Bee Here.. want to setup LinuxMCE..
Post by: Pnuts on April 09, 2009, 09:56:34 pm
Quote from: rednus on April 09, 2009, 08:54:14 pm
Quote from: Pnuts on April 09, 2009, 05:50:05 pm
I am planning on doing a similair thing. I am leaving a router in place and cascading the network down to the LinuxMCE Core so i have essentially 2 networks. This benifits me in a couple of ways. Wireless internet is available during a core reinstall or if its down for any reason. Also wife doesnt complain about no internet in these cases. Plus im still learning Linux in general while I know the router inside and out for configurations and settings.

at the bottom of my wiki page is what I eventually plan to do, just waiting on some hardware to arrive. http://wiki.linuxmce.org/index.php/User:Pnuts

Hi Pnuts, welcome to linux world.. hope the experience will be sweet and easy for you..

i am myself a linux geek since college but this is my first MCE installation.. so hoping to get all things sorted out without issues.. ;)

keep posting..


rednus

Thanks, so far so good. I've been running through the instructions here: http://www.linux.org/lessons/ just about done with the beginners courses. I think Linux and I are going to get along great, feel like im 14 again playing around in DOS   ;D