LinuxMCE Forums

General => Marketplace => Topic started by: bongowongo on September 12, 2012, 05:56:34 pm

Title: Re: Books, Manual, Training
Post by: bongowongo on September 12, 2012, 05:56:34 pm
To all whom read here,

I assume (we all know what that means) that for LinunMCE related products for sale and in search of this is the place to post. If I'm wrong please advise. I hate making the same mistake twice....

I am in search of the following to purchase, trade or obtain for "free":

1: A current - up-to-date - paperback, hardbook or CD on the installation, set-up and workings of a basic LinuxMCE,

2: A current - up-to-date - paperback, hardbook or CD of "advanced" workings of LinuxMCE ( like a CE based description, or, a LinuxMCE Bible),

3: Information and/or location of any LinuxMCE "CE" training or testing programs available in the U.S. (Texas) or website location for such,

4: Location of description of "Required Licenses" and how to obtain them if any are required,

5: Someone whom would be willing to provide me a detailed list (model numbers, description, etc..), or, a url,  of a complete working system they have set up. I found after reading a few forum post that some of the cards and such are either hard to find or no longer available. I am very eager to set-up a working system using current available equipment for my learning lab so I don't want to spend a lot of money on cards that I either don't need or won't work. I am willing to pay a reasonable amount for such a list.

I have a serious thirst for knowledge in projects like this. I would love to obtain any used books available as long as they are in fairly good shape and I'm not charged the original price paid (yes I'm a cheap tightwad). MUST BE IN ENGLISH, no offence to anyone, I'm too old to learn another language at this point in my life.  I will pay for shipping to the U.S. (Texas). I wish to obtain as much knowledge as possible from reading books or materials without reading the Wiki. I don't do well with wiki's.

Thanks for your time,

Amphibian


There are no books that I know of, but since you are a cheap tightwad why not try the wiki?
Title: Re: Books, Manual, Training
Post by: Marie.O on September 12, 2012, 06:36:19 pm
I have a copy of a book, that covers parts of the system. If you PM me your address, I shall forward it to you. You can PayPal me the shipping costs when you have received it.
Title: Re: Books, Manual, Training
Post by: l3mce on September 12, 2012, 06:49:47 pm
You cannot sell LinuxMCE. You clearly know this as you are purposefully being disingenuous about your reasons for wanting hard copy/setup information.

That is all.
Title: Re: Books, Manual, Training
Post by: tschak909 on September 13, 2012, 06:57:31 am
Unfortunately, amphibian. The number of people who have done this has been more than we can count on our hands.

Repeatedly, we have had people look at this system, their eyes pop out of their heads, and they see dollar signs.

They then go out, try to either get full sets of equipment lists from people, or work through it themselves, install a minimal system…then decide they want to do so for customers…

One example is someone who came into the community, we helped him for months to get a working install..then when it was done, he was imaging the install onto other people's machines, CHARGING THEM TO BUILD THE SYSTEM, and then when things went south, he at first sent his customers to IRC. When we found out he was doing this, he started fixing the problems himself, while hanging on IRC to ask questions while he was charging them by the hour!

I wish I could cite this as the only example, but it is one among many. It has left a very bad taste in our mouths, unfortunately, and has made us very angry when we see certain words or phrases uttered.

-Thom
Title: Re: Books, Manual, Training
Post by: l3mce on September 13, 2012, 02:45:46 pm
Sir 13mce,

you wrote "You cannot sell LinuxMCE. You clearly know this as you are purposefully being disingenuous about your reasons for wanting hard copy/setup information."

No where have I indicated or do I believe that I have lead anyone to thinking I wanted to "sell" LinuxMCE. I think I've made it very clear as to what my intentions are and also that I have been forthcoming in where I hope to be knowledge wise with the use of LinuxMCE.  Only a self-assuming, egotistical, self-righteous narcissistic SOB would even make such a statement to a newby (such as myself) to great a project that I feel LinuxMCE is. 

Even with all the Asterisk, Elastix PBX, Web, Mail and other like servers I posses not once have I sold or offered to sell the software or violated any license agreement to free and open source projects. Now I admit to being guilty as a reseller of  VoIP, offering answering & dispatch services, hosted PBX services, and development of training manuals as that is how I make my living, but not once have I ever offered to sell any PBX, Web and/or any associated hardware that includes or have installed open source licensed software. My only request for license information was to make sure that I didn't violate any copy-write laws pertaining to the recording, ripping or storing of music and videos on the server since I'm new to this project.

When I get involved with what I feel is an exciting project I go full force into learning it so that I can take full advantage of the project and eventually try to return the faavor of free by offering up knowledge that can help others. I have even been known to donate to the cause, including but not limited to, monies and the designing of hardware/software to further the project when it meant that it would benefit the multitudes of the masses. I belong to several groups in this state and we all have the same intentions. We like to take new ideas and make them work. There is no greater enjoyment then being able to be on the "ground floor" of a new project and being part of its advancement and make new ideas work.

Normally, being the sixty-two year old A**hole I am proud to be, I would tell you where you could put LinuxMCE but I'm not going to allow some inept like you to cause me to lower my standards to your level by doing so. I can though assure you that the likelihood of me wanting to jump and have any further desire to offer up my asterisk knowledge or other assistance on this project is not likely to happen any time soon.  It's people like you that force good well intentioned individuals to want to run as far as one can the other direction. If you are a resemblance of what one has to look forward to on this forum when asking for assistance or knowledge then I may well be wasting my time being here.

Amphibian

You can feign all the offense you like. I have been here a while. You HAPPEN to resell VOIP software. You HAPPEN to "make your living" selling training materials. The extensive wiki on how to do just about anything does not satisfy your needs. And you want details of working setups...

You plan on making money on this system. Point blank. You don't want to set up a system, you don't need specific help, you do not offer any contribution. You can come up with all the adjectives you like to attack me with... your motives are transparent. I am sorry if you thought you were being clever.


You want to setup a specific system, I will bend over backwards to help you. I will write custom code for you. I will help any way I can. This isn't your deal. You are offering to pay for lists of plug and play hardware, when it is available for free.

If I am wrong, then I am wrong. It has happened at least 3 times in the past.

You could sell hardcopy if you wanted btw. You would have to generate it yourself. Just be straightforward. Be honest. It isn't a big ask. If you were JUST thirsty for knowledge, it is all out there between the forum and wiki. You want to generate copy... and sell it for a modest fee. Gathering existing copy would save untold hours trying to do so. The abstract nature of wiki is not desirable if you are trying to assemble training material.

You aren't here to write code, but books... which... again... is ok. Just be straight.

Title: Re: Books, Manual, Training
Post by: l3mce on September 13, 2012, 03:53:04 pm
I guess that is easier than being honest.

Lol at creating a home automation "program" not being "that hard". See Google's android@home... or Microsoft HomeOS. I expect your resources are probably greater. Again... thirst does not go unquenched with liquid in front of you. You do not have a thirst for knowledge... you have dollar signs in your eyes. You are now having a fight or flight reflex being exposed.

I am sure we will see you again.

Next time, just be straightforward. I spend 100 hours per week on average helping people... for no reason other than I want this project to exist. All I ask in return is the thing you seem incapable of. I guess it is a hazard of a life in sales.

BTW I am just a user. I do not represent LinuxMCE. I am one of the more active ones, but I am not the project and have no vested interest or authority.
Title: Re: Books, Manual, Training
Post by: bongowongo on September 13, 2012, 05:04:45 pm
I guess that is easier than being honest.

Lol at creating a home automation "program" not being "that hard". See Google's android@home... or Microsoft HomeOS. I expect your resources are probably greater. Again... thirst does not go unquenched with liquid in front of you. You do not have a thirst for knowledge... you have dollar signs in your eyes. You are now having a fight or flight reflex being exposed.

I am sure we will see you again.

Next time, just be straightforward. I spend 100 hours per week on average helping people... for no reason other than I want this project to exist. All I ask in return is the thing you seem incapable of. I guess it is a hazard of a life in sales.

BTW I am just a user. I do not represent LinuxMCE. I am one of the more active ones, but I am not the project and have no vested interest or authority.

I have bongosigns in my eyes
Title: Re: Books, Manual, Training
Post by: davegravy on September 14, 2012, 01:58:22 am
/me reaches slowly into popcorn bag
Title: Re: Books, Manual, Training
Post by: tschak909 on September 14, 2012, 02:35:18 am
for the record, looks like this guy is gone.

-Thom
Title: Re: Books, Manual, Training
Post by: hari on September 14, 2012, 03:03:42 pm
I have a few LinuxMCE for dummies for sale, they come with current supported hardware list. But you need to pay via western union.
Title: Re: Books, Manual, Training
Post by: bongowongo on September 14, 2012, 04:00:35 pm
I have a few LinuxMCE for dummies for sale, they come with current supported hardware list. But you need to pay via western union.

We all know you are a nigerian prince.
Title: Re: Books, Manual, Training
Post by: Marie.O on September 14, 2012, 04:27:25 pm
and you are his princess
Title: Re: Books, Manual, Training
Post by: dowster on September 19, 2012, 04:56:04 pm
On a serious note, are we against charging for a professional setup of linuxMCE and end user support. By charging I'm thinking of only hardware and labor of hardware installation, the os and os setup would have to be free, correct?
Title: Re: Books, Manual, Training
Post by: JaseP on September 19, 2012, 09:40:01 pm
Pluto Public License, via wayback...
http://web.archive.org/web/20061021011334/http://plutohome.com/index.php?section=public_license

Title: Re: Books, Manual, Training
Post by: hari on September 19, 2012, 10:27:15 pm
On a serious note, are we against charging for a professional setup of linuxMCE and end user support. By charging I'm thinking of only hardware and labor of hardware installation, the os and os setup would have to be free, correct?

there is no problem with charging somebody for a professional setup. But it should be a professional setup and not just a default install where the customer is referred to the forum/irc to search for help to get his installation working :-)
Title: Re: Books, Manual, Training
Post by: tschak909 on September 19, 2012, 10:58:59 pm
Most of us who have been around, have experienced this, _first hand_.

-Thom
Title: Re: Books, Manual, Training
Post by: jamo on November 09, 2012, 02:32:10 pm
Hello

My name is James and I'm...

not an alcoholic. But I do have a confession to make-

I too have dreamed of earning money via linuxMCE.

I've been afraid to bring it up before because although I don't know the history, I've often come across posts on the forum where people have been sent packing when there was any sort of commercial flavour to their interest in this project. I bring it up now partly because the issue has come up again and partly because I've almost given up on that dream...

Deep breath... so can I ask the following of you guys-

Firstly, please don't alienate me and chase me out of town with pitchforks for raising this discussion. I love linuxMCE and would love to be part of the project, ultimately contributing once I have built up the skills to do so. I've tried a bit but I'm still very green. Regardless of whether or not you guys dash my dream of quitting my dayjob for this, I want to stick with the project for personal use and, as I said above, keep my software skills sharp by contributing.

And then, be gently honest with me about the issues surrounding earning an income related to linuxMCE. I'll tell you my thinking, and you can, gently, explain where I'm off track.

Here goes.

Reasoning- quite simple, of course. I want to do something (for a living that is) that I love. Which is greedy at this point because I have a pretty decent job in software development and I almost love it. But it's in a big corporate with all the red-tape and process and egos and bad decisions and poor management and closed-source, proprietary software and so difficult to actually do anything that really adds value. And a wee bit less flexible in terms of time and location than I would, in my greediness, like.

So for a long time I've been thinking I need to "do my own thing". And then I was introduced to linuxMCE. And it blew my socks off. Not from the dollar-potential, but just because it really ticked all the boxes for me. Open-source, freely avaiable, linux-based and basically intrinsically better than anything else out there. So I got stuck in and blundered around as a newbie does, figuring out how I can set up my own system. Then, shortly after getting my first MD up and running, I got the idea that maybe this was it... maybe if I could get the skills in this I could somehow earn a living helping people set up their own systems. And if I could do that, wouldn't that just be my dream job?

My idea was that I would not sell the software or the hardware... I would sell my time. My time would be sold as advice/ desgin/ consulting/ support/ assistance or actual setup. Yes, I imagined selling turnkey type solutions but explicitly with the lids off both in terms of hardware and software- eg. I can either design the system for you and charge you for my time (you can buy the hardware and install it) or I can design it, charge for my time and charge for my time sourcing the hardware and setting it up. And I would always be absolutely open and upfront about the whole thing - point the to the project, explain that it was free and open and they could do it themselves if they wanted or, at any time, chuck my services and take over.

Now, to my mind, that didn't violate any of the licenses.... and maybe it would have worked, maybe it wouldn't. Certainly I'm nowhere near having the skills or knowhow to do it....

But then with more reading on the forums, I came across the posts where anyone with a commercial interest was sent packing. Of course, in all the cases I agreed with the lambasting because it was some joker coming on as a complete newbie and essentially wanting the community to help him for free while he earned cash. And that wasn't even vaguely where my dream was... but some of the comments made me think it went quite a bit beyond that... to the point where any type of income earned related to linuxMCE was going to get you ostracised from the community. That's how it appears at least. 

And if that's the case, I'm quite prepared to accept that and forget about my dream and carry on as a normal (for now) and hopefully one day super user that can give back more than I got out.

However, if it's not the case, and some of you guys are prepared to clarify to me what the position of the community is in this regard, without forever hating me ignoring me on IRC and forums just for raising this, then I'd really welcome your feedback. This thread happens to include most of the guys that I respect in the community already so it seemed the ideal place to post this question.

Thoughts? Flames? Severe beatings?

Incidentally, believe it or not, I hoped that if by some chance I was successful with my venture, I would really be able to give back in  a big way. You see, currently I have a std day job that more or less supports the family, full time at home and very little time I can give to linuxMCE. Which was one of the reasons I hoped to make it my vocation. Because then I could devote all my working time to the project.... and hopefully not just mine, but a team of developers. See, I already manage a team of software developers... that's what I do. And I thought of bailing, starting my own company, and then pulling the best of them in to work on linuxMCE- Firstly to become experts in it, and secondly to start contributing. Obviously we'd be contributing in specific areas where we felt there was a market but being open source, everything we developed would go straight back to the project for everyone to use. Because we wouldn't be selling the software or the hardware, we'd be selling our expertise... so success for linuxMCE would mean success and a market for us.

Don't laugh.

I welcome your thoughts guys. Be gentle.... it's not everyday someone tells you their dream!
Title: Re: Books, Manual, Training
Post by: hari on November 09, 2012, 08:15:47 pm
Just be aware that parts of the code are licensed under the Pluto Public License, and the current copyright holders have an exclusive deal with a big vendor. So chances to get a bunch of licenses from them are basically NIL, nada, null, VOID. If you want to sell licenses maybe talk to Dianemo. They did get their licenses before Pluto sold the copyright. I don't know how many they have left, but this is probably the only currently possible approach to get some.
Title: Re: Books, Manual, Training
Post by: jamo on November 12, 2012, 07:53:44 am
Thanks, Hari.

Any idea who this is? =>
current copyright holders

And this vendor =>
exclusive deal with a big vendor.